Ellis And Attention

[Candy Ray]

Ellis likes me to post her sigil- I hope that's all right because I haven't seen many pictures on this forum. What do you folks think about attention-seeking entities? I've been told that Ellis gives as much energy as she takes, often more. Also that her sigil creates a crack in reality and unites the physical and astral worlds, and when sceptics look at it they are stimulated to believe in magic.

I used to be very wary of any entity that encouraged me to preach because I don't want to annoy people, like someone knocking on the door with a huge smile and waving a tract. This is exactly the same, though it might be intended to look more 'cool'- to use the meaningless word everyone uses. What do you think, do you think she is making me preach?

[Candy Ray]

No-one interested in this? As Ellis started out on the original version of this forum in about 2004 maybe everyone here is bored with her. Or perhaps you don't like me to say 'her', you would rather I said 'it', the Linking Sigil. Hmm, 'do you think it is making me preach' doesn't really work. It's a she to me.

[Maya The Generator]

I am interested but don't have knowledge to tell something constructive. But I would love to know more. How she works?

[Clockwork Ghost]

No-one interested in this? As Ellis started out on the original version of this forum in about 2004 maybe everyone here is bored with her. Or perhaps you don't like me to say 'her', you would rather I said 'it', the Linking Sigil. Hmm, 'do you think it is making me preach' doesn't really work. It's a she to me.

I wouldn't say that nobody is interested, this forum just runs a bit slower than other forums from time to time. I'm personally interested in Ellis. Could you please tell us more about her, and the work you have done with her?

[Candy Ray]

I will explain why Ellis is an attention-seeker, which should answer the other questions too. Her creator Arjil designed her to be 'tagged' which means you draw her on things: things like forums [grin2] and brick walls and stones. Personally I don't like creating graffiti and it is often illegal, but you can get round that, for example by drawing her on a stone and leaving it in a prominent position. The whole area and the people who pass by become more receptive to magic, and there are often crazy chaos fluxes so it's best to concentrate on the effect you want so as not to get a really mad effect. You can then move on from doing that to designing rituals and other sigils and servitors around the Ellis sigil, so they will be powered from her network.

What I was asking here is do you think Ellis is pushy? Just before I joined her group DKMU I had been studyong Paganism and Pagans think it's wrong to do any proseletysing at all. They wait for people to approach them. The human beings who tag are not trying to convert anyone because all beliefs are allowed, but I do feel that the entity Ellis behaves like she's recruiting people, and holds onto the ones she gets really tightly. Sorry if that wasn't clear, you wouldn't know about me feeling like she's got her hand on my collar unless I told you!

[Maya The Generator]

Thats very interesting, I remeber from World of Darkness(kind of game about vampires). There is Malkavian clan, they all are damned with insanity BUT every malk is connected to other so they work as a network. But having answers is not so nice if you cant connect them to right questions right?
So I always thought making web in magic society would end in some similar way. I can't imagine that the only cost for using "her" name and appearance is to "spread the word". But I will surely look into her cause she surely make me curious.

[RoseRed]

I will explain why Ellis is an attention-seeker, which should answer the other questions too. Her creator Arjil designed her to be 'tagged' which means you draw her on things: things like forums [grin2] and brick walls and stones. Personally I don't like creating graffiti and it is often illegal, but you can get round that, for example by drawing her on a stone and leaving it in a prominent position. The whole area and the people who pass by become more receptive to magic, and there are often crazy chaos fluxes so it's best to concentrate on the effect you want so as not to get a really mad effect. You can then move on from doing that to designing rituals and other sigils and servitors around the Ellis sigil, so they will be powered from her network.

What I was asking here is do you think Ellis is pushy? Just before I joined her group DKMU I had been studyong Paganism and Pagans think it's wrong to do any proseletysing at all. They wait for people to approach them. The human beings who tag are not trying to convert anyone because all beliefs are allowed, but I do feel that the entity Ellis behaves like she's recruiting people, and holds onto the ones she gets really tightly. Sorry if that wasn't clear, you wouldn't know about me feeling like she's got her hand on my collar unless I told you!

Why are you taking orders from someone elses servitor?

And that's kind of a sweeping generalization. Granted, I haven't come across to many pagans proselyting. I am Pagan but I am not part of a group. I don't really think about whether it's right or wrong - I generally don't think about it at all.

[Shinichi]

I would hardly call Ellis an attention seeker, despite the way we met. She enjoys it, certainly, but I'm not sure I believe that she is directly encouraging you to preach anything. Your own biases may be misinterpreting another message entirely, or you may be otherwise over thinking a far more simple piece of advice.

I'm also quite aware of what her sigil does, but she can do a lot more than that now. There are actually two sigils, an input and an output that has constructed a metaphysical web of power and information. Every time the input sigil is used, Ellis not only gains access to the Energy of that location or thing, but also the information there. She has had several years to learn now, and she has learned much. LS is a web, but Ellis is its spider - and she is a powerful spider indeed, because everything in the web is hers.

Why are you taking orders from someone elses servitor?

I hardly think DKMU can claim full ownership of Ellis anymore, and she most certainly doesn't think so. They gave her an independent intelligence, and she's grown to be a very independent gal. Some may claim authority over her and some may actually have authority over her as with any spirit, but an initially clunky and artificial experiment has grown to be something quite organic now.



~:Shin:~

[RoseRed]

That is so cool.

[Shinichi]

Yes, it is. But don't feed her ego too much. [razz]



~:Shin:~

[EternalReturn]

I believe I was visited last night. I had a strong, brief flash of gnostic state which came from nowhere. I've never experienced anything like that.

[Clockwork Ghost]

Ellis isn't a servitor, and I'm pretty sure she's progressed past being an egregore. I believe Ellis is a node. My company site's symbol is now Ellis, a graphic designer friend of mine in the DKMU made one especially for me. [grin]

[ultimafool]

"Randomly" stumbled across eLliS somehow and remembered seeing this thread (obviously). Guess my recent urge to do some more Project Mayhem-style Operation Mindfuck glamour-bombing again tuned in to the web. Pretty weird in the best possible way! Adding mo' nodez to the net.

[Haqim]

The idea of linking sigils fascinates me.

But yeah, I think Ellis had its time and I'm not surprised that most occultists forgot it.

Many chaotes would hate me for this, but I have to say it anyway: I think this whole Ellis project was started and followed only by "hipster" and "wannabe" branches of chaos magic.

It's like Eris fan clubs.
Ok, it's fun, of course - but that's all.

[Liberator]

Made me feel more energetic for some reason. Feeling like I want more entropy.

[Candy Ray]

The idea of linking sigils fascinates me.

But yeah, I think Ellis had its time and I'm not surprised that most occultists forgot it.

Many chaotes would hate me for this, but I have to say it anyway: I think this whole Ellis project was started and followed only by "hipster" and "wannabe" branches of chaos magic.

It's like Eris fan clubs.
Ok, it's fun, of course - but that's all.

When I started this topic I was doing a sort of backhanded thing, as I belong to Ellis' group: I was helping her to get your attention, and at the same time criticizing her mildly for being an attention seeker. But I wouldn't say it's just fun and laughter and nothing else, like some of the Eris groups. When I experiment with Ellis-related things I get more concrete results than I've ever had with anything else. There have been some magicians who have been a bit huffy about it. I remember one discussion on Facebook (which is where all Ellis' followers usually are) in which a new inquirer said, "what do you mean, people aren't used to something that actually works? I am well used to that."
Well, personally until I came in contact with Ellis I was not used to anything at all which actually works.

All the evidence is that Ellis is becoming a bigger and bigger attention seeker. A lot of people have said lately that she is pushing and prodding them to advertise her more widely.

[Candy Ray]

I don't suppose you like double posts but I have to add something else: I DID experience things that actually worked in the past, but after they happened I returned to a normal state of consciousness and my mind tuned them out as if they had never been. One effect of making a split in the veil was that I became aware of those incidents, made a list of as many of them as I could remember, and decided "never again."

[777Sloan]

Eris-chan feeds on attention. So, feed her. It is love that helps invigorate her being.

[cyberdemon]

Eris-chan?! Oh no, the weebs are here.. Good! More of my kind.

The Ellis project fascinates me. But apart from doing her spidery web weaving, Ellis doesn't do much else. She's literally stuck to eternally building a web without a real reason now. I'll summon her when I have time/energy to spare, in all honesty, but I don't see the point of it.

[Candy Ray]

I wouldn't say that she's eternally building a web without a real reason. There are always new people coming along in the DKMU and in the wider chaos magick scene as well , and she can give power to their magical workings and help them learn how to be magicians. She can also help them to move out of the world view of consensus reality because that's what she is designed to do. I'm in charge of the group for new people, 'oistars' they are called, it means the oysters in the poem 'The Walrus And The Carpenter' ! A lot of them need help with confidence and I do too, I've never been a confident person.

If this sounds like mothering people I must add that nowadays it seems to be the trend for figures to have something of the anti-hero, and Ellis certainly fits that because she is a kind of spider demon. Look at the heroine of 'Frozen' who has gone totally viral, partly due to clever marketing certainly, but partly also because she is a modern anti-heroine. One of the other DKMU godforms TheWhite Queen is very much like Elsa in 'Frozen' and you can use all the same symbolism for her.

Then of course, Ellis doesn't have to be anthropomorphic, she can be used as just a sigil and people do do find that combining it with their own sigils makes the sigil much stronger. It gets an influx of power into it.

[777Sloan]

[quote="cyberdemon"]Eris-chan?! Oh no, the weebs are here.. Good! More of my kind.

The Ellis project fascinates me. But apart from doing her spidery web weaving, Ellis doesn't do much else. She's literally stuck to eternally building a web without a real reason now. I'll summon her when I have time/energy to spare, in all honesty, but I don't see the point of it.[/quote

いやだな。。。本物なんだよ、私。　ま、ありがとうな。

[Maya The Generator]

I hate. . . 'm Genuine article do, I. Well, thank you. ?

[777Sloan]

I hate. . . 'm Genuine article do, I. Well, thank you. ?

Translation programs lack the algorithms to translate certain languages coherently. They may translate word for word, but cannot reorganize language in a manner logical to Western sensibilities. The reasons for this are nuanced and manifold, but...elaborate explanations tend to be unpopular in today's culture; so In that interest, I'll refrain from further verbosity.

[Maya The Generator]

That is nothing new to a person learning language the yolo way. Still I am very interested what you wrote in kanjis, if it of course is not a secret. [crazy]

Edit: You should see what I got after translating it to my native language, "so many possibilities".

To topic: I see a lot of "webbing" today, things merges or are connected via so many options and on so many planes. Is there more "webbing" in occult world on scale similar to Ellis? I am not sure If I am not little scared coz the only knowledge with the real webs is that: If you are on the web and you are not a spider, you will have a bad time(unless you are 100x time bigger and it is not venomus [thumbup] )

[777Sloan]

That is nothing new to a person learning language the yolo way. Still I am very interested what you wrote in kanjis, if it of course is not a secret. [crazy]

Edit: You should see what I got after translating it to my native language, "so many possibilities".

To topic: I see a lot of "webbing" today, things merges or are connected via so many options and on so many planes. Is there more "webbing" in occult world on scale similar to Ellis? I am not sure If I am not little scared coz the only knowledge with the real webs is that: If you are on the web and you are not a spider, you will have a bad time(unless you are 100x time bigger and it is not venomus [thumbup] )

Some things are unable to translate due to subtle cultural nuance variation and corresponding minutiae of connotation. An emoticon will be utilized where translation lacking.

"いやだな。。。本物なんだよ、私。　ま、ありがとうな。"

"Oh come now...I am the real deal, ya know. (^_-) Well, whatever the case, thank you regardless."