Why I'm Leaving the Forum

[anton]

I'm agnostic myself, but that doesn't stop me from practising.

I simply use the technique of 'suspension of disbelief' in ritual. I find the spirits behave and respond more intelligently when I believe in them. Whether they are voices in my head, telepathic aliens, ascended masters, secret chiefs, angels, daimons, djinn, goetic entities, nature spirits, gods, goddesses, hermaphroditic deities, fae, trolls, or whatever in actuality matters not. The techniques work.

And by work, I mean that they produce certain mystical experiences.

Of course having experiences doesn't tell us what those experiences are. Watching a movie and learning how a projector and film works are two different things. Exceptional claims don't need exceptional evidence when watching a movie. Otherwise we couldn't enjoy watching 'Superman' or 'Lord of the Rings'.

So, giving up magic because you can't find proof? Fine, sounds to me like you don't actually enjoy magic anyway. I practise magic because I enjoy practising magic. I enjoy the experiences it provides that I would miss in my life if I didn't practise magic.

And I did perform your 'leaving magic behind' experiment myself a few years back. I felt the same disillusionment. It was through observing my life becoming duller and duller as a result that I realised why I needed magic in my life. If you find the same happens to you, its because you can't live without magic. If on the other hand it matters not, then you never needed magic in the first place, and proving it true or false would make no difference to that.

[NLDSatanist666]

Well, after much thought, I've decided that the only way to really know if occult things exist is to experience them firsthand. I am going to go on a Satanic self-exploration journey and find out what's really real. I'm going to start with psionics, as they seem pretty cool.

[Nahemah]

Cool. [thumbup]

We're still here for any questions, or if you want to share results or conclusions. [grin]

[Vovi]

The fact that so many people on sites like these, even with all the info out there, still miss the point, perplexes me. Even many who have proved unto their self in the existence of higher planes and all that...STILL miss the point and serve the ego. Those who throw it out the window do so because the lust of result was not met according to what they wanted to get from it. The mysteries take many lifetimes to uncover, and many think that a year or two of study in order to satisfy the curiosity of the ego should be able to give results when they demand them. I don't agree with the teachings of the church, therefore I don't go to christian websites and waste my time reading the things they post there. If I did those things, then perhaps in my heart I actually am a church goer in this incarnation.

[infernalmonkofSatan]

I could go really in depth with this post with lots of personal reasons and other fun stuff, but I'm going to make a long story short. I've basicly applied scientific scrutiny to my beliefs about gods, magick, spirits, Hermeticism and occultism in general and after much thought have decided to become agnostic about them. I don't think we can ever know if there's a god or if magick actually works or if the All is real. For every story where a spell worked really well or someone channeled a god and got good, factual information from it, there's a contradictory one. I think that until any of these things are proven to be real, the most logical intellectual position (for me at least) is to be agnostic about them. This isn't a magickal "rage-quit", as I've had some of the spells I've cast in my year of being an occultist work and some not work. Please note that I have nothing against people who believe in occultism. If you believe something and it works for you and that belief isn't harming anyone else, then great! Go for it! I just think that for me, agnosticism is the right intellectual stance.

I probably won't be coming back to this forum.

I don't intend to eschew spirituality entirely though. I've gone back to being a Laveyan Satanist (I used to be a Laveyan before I became an occultist) because I feel like it's a good philosophy for me to follow. Plus, I think ritual is fun even if you don't believe in that it will affect the outside world.

So yeah...see ya!

Try Chaos magic and sigil magic then get back to me.