Original post: endor957
wow, i've just read this post from beginning to end and i saw that necromage brought up mental sex and altering mental perceptions so this is kind of pointed personally at me so i will say this not in defense but in adressing necromage;
i see that you have a very serious attitude about your ideals in magick and i'm not debating over the issue of you thinking what you percieve is the same for all. eventhough, i also think that this is a wrong perception, i don't care about that.
if you obviously have a problem with the threads that you have mentioned, i am glad that you have not participated in them.
i will agree that there are many young minded or inexperienced people on this board, and they may be very irresponsible with what they will try out. but when a person starts anything, they have to bust their ass, because how could they know what not to do if they didn't make a mistake?
i can understand, respect and accept your overall displeasement with what you might find on this board to a point.
but why don't you participate with helping those to know where they are wrong at. this is why we come here and discuss topics.
and at the same time, i am insulted that you would find a topic about mental sex to be negative, have you not seen how responsible i was trying to make that thread to be discussed?
all i am going to say is you have a right to feel the way you do, but you are wrong about how you choose to correct what you find wrong here (if that's what your real intentions were), and you're too serious.
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Original post: NecroMage
[QUOTE=Ludi]No, what this means, NecroMage, is that you are incapable of making yourself understood. You are, as far as I can tell, virtually incapable of communicating with others, at least in this venue. Nor, as far as I can tell from the way you present yourself, are you at all interested in trying to communicate clearly.[/QUOTE]
You are absolutely correct, but you are wasting your breath. I said the exact same thing in different terms, repeating me will not change anything, although it may accent the statement. I failed to make myself understood and the others failed at understanding me. Communication is a two way process. If one side fails, both fail, it is no one's fault.
[QUOTE=Ludi]We could ask you questions about your experiences so that we too could have an idea of the "dangers" involved in magic, but I suspect your answers would be so unclear that it would be no help whatsoever. You say you are always right, or at least, I get the strong impression you believe you are always right, and that you somehow know "the truth" about magic. That your personal experiences, whatever they are, somehow reflect the true reality for everyone. How do you know that? How do you know that what you experience is the objective truth? Can you demonstrate it to be true in any way whatsoever?[/QUOTE]First of all, you seem to have missed a fairly important part of what I have said.
"or I am wrong, because my sight is interefered by my thoughts or feelings"
The above happens more than it should, especially as of late due to my lack of energy, but that is a different story. As for my experiences, well if you want to know, I will tell you, but it seems as though you are simply spitting venom at me regardless of what I say. Perhaps you actually want to know, but until you ask me in a more civilized and in a bit friendlier context, I will take it as part of the context.
You do have a point though. I did not develop communication skills as well as I've developed my skills in magic, and my deficiency is fairly obvious. However, I can still get the message accross, even if it takes me several posts.
Rin Daemoko, thank you and you are welcome. I have learned to keep inner peace through all the trials through which I've been, and thus learned not to be aggravated by... pretty much anything.
Speaking of which, before you all start about how I boast about myself or if I was so great, why [fill in whatever you want here], let me just say that I tell things as close to the truth as I know. I do indeed have inner peace, and I would not lie simply to appear more humble. I of course do make mistakes, as is fairly apparent, and in recent days, I am weak as a kitten, but I am a sorcerer, and I learned to control my folly. I've become far more controlled than I ever was and most people are. I accept that as a fact, regardless of whether it makes me appear better than people, or "cooler" or anything like that. Boasting can only work if one has an ego, and I do my best to try to destroy mine.
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]Do you have a set of questions against with you are able to verfiy what you think or see as being truthful? I find that when I come into a new probability, I find myself asking a set of questions which are geared at determining if this new probability is viable or accurate. It helps to keep me from slipping into delusive thinking which some on this forum have been known to succumb to every now and then.[/QUOTE]
That's exactly the point, to not have any questions. We try to see things without thought. We try not to comprehend or even translate it into anything near thought. Sorcerers see things at the essense, before thought and everything superficial is added. No words, pictures, or sounds, just direct information. Of course, it can be translated into something comprehensible, but as soon as that happens, most of the information is lost.
Just so I do not seem like some crazy lone trumpeteer, here is a link that says all about sorcerers. It is taken from books by Carlos Costaneda. Don Juan said all there is to know about sorcery far better than I ever could.
http://www.prismagems.com/castaneda/djintro.html
[QUOTE=Ludi]No, what this means, NecroMage, is that you are incapable of making yourself understood. You are, as far as I can tell, virtually incapable of communicating with others, at least in this venue. Nor, as far as I can tell from the way you present yourself, are you at all interested in trying to communicate clearly.[/QUOTE]
You are absolutely correct, but you are wasting your breath. I said the exact same thing in different terms, repeating me will not change anything, although it may accent the statement. I failed to make myself understood and the others failed at understanding me. Communication is a two way process. If one side fails, both fail, it is no one's fault.
[QUOTE=Ludi]We could ask you questions about your experiences so that we too could have an idea of the "dangers" involved in magic, but I suspect your answers would be so unclear that it would be no help whatsoever. You say you are always right, or at least, I get the strong impression you believe you are always right, and that you somehow know "the truth" about magic. That your personal experiences, whatever they are, somehow reflect the true reality for everyone. How do you know that? How do you know that what you experience is the objective truth? Can you demonstrate it to be true in any way whatsoever?[/QUOTE]First of all, you seem to have missed a fairly important part of what I have said.
"or I am wrong, because my sight is interefered by my thoughts or feelings"
The above happens more than it should, especially as of late due to my lack of energy, but that is a different story. As for my experiences, well if you want to know, I will tell you, but it seems as though you are simply spitting venom at me regardless of what I say. Perhaps you actually want to know, but until you ask me in a more civilized and in a bit friendlier context, I will take it as part of the context.
You do have a point though. I did not develop communication skills as well as I've developed my skills in magic, and my deficiency is fairly obvious. However, I can still get the message accross, even if it takes me several posts.
Rin Daemoko, thank you and you are welcome. I have learned to keep inner peace through all the trials through which I've been, and thus learned not to be aggravated by... pretty much anything.
Speaking of which, before you all start about how I boast about myself or if I was so great, why [fill in whatever you want here], let me just say that I tell things as close to the truth as I know. I do indeed have inner peace, and I would not lie simply to appear more humble. I of course do make mistakes, as is fairly apparent, and in recent days, I am weak as a kitten, but I am a sorcerer, and I learned to control my folly. I've become far more controlled than I ever was and most people are. I accept that as a fact, regardless of whether it makes me appear better than people, or "cooler" or anything like that. Boasting can only work if one has an ego, and I do my best to try to destroy mine.
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]Do you have a set of questions against with you are able to verfiy what you think or see as being truthful? I find that when I come into a new probability, I find myself asking a set of questions which are geared at determining if this new probability is viable or accurate. It helps to keep me from slipping into delusive thinking which some on this forum have been known to succumb to every now and then.[/QUOTE]
That's exactly the point, to not have any questions. We try to see things without thought. We try not to comprehend or even translate it into anything near thought. Sorcerers see things at the essense, before thought and everything superficial is added. No words, pictures, or sounds, just direct information. Of course, it can be translated into something comprehensible, but as soon as that happens, most of the information is lost.
Just so I do not seem like some crazy lone trumpeteer, here is a link that says all about sorcerers. It is taken from books by Carlos Costaneda. Don Juan said all there is to know about sorcery far better than I ever could.
http://www.prismagems.com/castaneda/djintro.html
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Original post: NecroMage
How can I prove what I know? Well it is a stupid question in the first place. One cannot really prove anything. For example, 2 + 2 = 4, but how can one prove that? Well, we know that 2 is a symbol that inherently means two abstract objects of the same type, and when two of two are combined, one gets four abstract objects of the same type. Simple logic.
And yet there is a problem. For what exactly are these abstract objects? They only exist for the moment that we need them in our minds, as virtual objects. But what are they? Without words, pictures, or any kind of thoughts in general, all we have to rely on is feelings.
Feelings are direct information. It turns into thoughts and pictures when our minds become involved, but originally, it is all a feeling.
2 + 2 = 4 because our feelings deem that logically it is true, and then we think it through and seem to have come up with the answer. So this is what sorcerers do; they stop thinking, and percieve information as directly as possible.
I can do this, but not as well as I should. My thoughts have too much power and I have too little energy to control them, as of late, but I am progressing, albeit slowly.
How can I prove what I know? I cannot, because most of what I know is already a direct feeling. Using logic on it is useless, for definitions and meanings dissipate rather rapidly.
PS - Ludi, I hope that in all this I have not treaded on you in any way. You seem to be extremely offended, and I do not quite understand why. If I have wronged you, tell me how and I shall attempt to mend things.
How can I prove what I know? Well it is a stupid question in the first place. One cannot really prove anything. For example, 2 + 2 = 4, but how can one prove that? Well, we know that 2 is a symbol that inherently means two abstract objects of the same type, and when two of two are combined, one gets four abstract objects of the same type. Simple logic.
And yet there is a problem. For what exactly are these abstract objects? They only exist for the moment that we need them in our minds, as virtual objects. But what are they? Without words, pictures, or any kind of thoughts in general, all we have to rely on is feelings.
Feelings are direct information. It turns into thoughts and pictures when our minds become involved, but originally, it is all a feeling.
2 + 2 = 4 because our feelings deem that logically it is true, and then we think it through and seem to have come up with the answer. So this is what sorcerers do; they stop thinking, and percieve information as directly as possible.
I can do this, but not as well as I should. My thoughts have too much power and I have too little energy to control them, as of late, but I am progressing, albeit slowly.
How can I prove what I know? I cannot, because most of what I know is already a direct feeling. Using logic on it is useless, for definitions and meanings dissipate rather rapidly.
PS - Ludi, I hope that in all this I have not treaded on you in any way. You seem to be extremely offended, and I do not quite understand why. If I have wronged you, tell me how and I shall attempt to mend things.
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Original post: NecroMage
Endor, I did not mean to direct you with this, I only used your (they are yours, right?) thread(s) as an example. You speak in a very mature and intellegent manner, as is your subject matter, but unfortunately, I associated "mental sex" with something I heard long before on a chat room. It was a very unprofessional room, with a bunch of lowlife idiots pretending to know something about magic, and their highest subject seemed to be 'astral sex' so consequentially I made the association. Your thread was fairly good in most concerns and I apoligize for any offenses.
The question has been brought up of what should be done about all this. I love sorcery because of its contradictions. It is chock full of them, and the best way to answer the question would be with one.
A magician should be cautious, but should leap into the unkown.
Do not argue with that statement, just yet. Just read it a few times and think about it. Or rather, "feel" about it. I understand that it is contradicting, you do not have to tell me. Yes it is completely illogical, and yes I seem like dolt saying it. Appearances can be deceiving, so why don't we just look past them and see what's really there. Look past the statement, and see the meaning. That's what every beginner, or every advanced mage should do.
By the way, if you still cannot understand the statement, feel free to ignore it, and don't flame me on the way. It is never wise to attack that which you cannot understand.
I cannot teach anyone sorcery, but I can say enough to request that one sees it for themselves. I can say enough so that my listener might learn how to get to seeing it. However, I'm not trying to do any of these things to anyone on this board. As much as I would enjoy it if you were all sorcerers, I am not the one to do that.
Endor, I did not mean to direct you with this, I only used your (they are yours, right?) thread(s) as an example. You speak in a very mature and intellegent manner, as is your subject matter, but unfortunately, I associated "mental sex" with something I heard long before on a chat room. It was a very unprofessional room, with a bunch of lowlife idiots pretending to know something about magic, and their highest subject seemed to be 'astral sex' so consequentially I made the association. Your thread was fairly good in most concerns and I apoligize for any offenses.
The question has been brought up of what should be done about all this. I love sorcery because of its contradictions. It is chock full of them, and the best way to answer the question would be with one.
A magician should be cautious, but should leap into the unkown.
Do not argue with that statement, just yet. Just read it a few times and think about it. Or rather, "feel" about it. I understand that it is contradicting, you do not have to tell me. Yes it is completely illogical, and yes I seem like dolt saying it. Appearances can be deceiving, so why don't we just look past them and see what's really there. Look past the statement, and see the meaning. That's what every beginner, or every advanced mage should do.
By the way, if you still cannot understand the statement, feel free to ignore it, and don't flame me on the way. It is never wise to attack that which you cannot understand.
I cannot teach anyone sorcery, but I can say enough to request that one sees it for themselves. I can say enough so that my listener might learn how to get to seeing it. However, I'm not trying to do any of these things to anyone on this board. As much as I would enjoy it if you were all sorcerers, I am not the one to do that.
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Original post: Rin Daemoko
And I admire that.
Ah, I see. It is like the Zen concept of No-Mind. There is only perception and not thought. There is just seeing, no seer and nothing seen. There is just hearing, no hearer and nothing heard. This is something I can understand.
But surely you must have some method of separating truth from fiction? Do new probabilities interact with the current set of probabilites acting on our realities in a compatible and harmonic manner?
But, to reiterate. You said that many magicians were reckless and wasteful of their skills. How do you propose to remedy this? Far be it for something with confidence such as yourself to propose a problem without a solution in mind.
NecroMage wrote:Speaking of which, before you all start about how I boast about myself or if I was so great, why [fill in whatever you want here], let me just say that I tell things as close to the truth as I know. I do indeed have inner peace, and I would not lie simply to appear more humble. I of course do make mistakes, as is fairly apparent, and in recent days, I am weak as a kitten, but I am a sorcerer, and I learned to control my folly. I've become far more controlled than I ever was and most people are. I accept that as a fact, regardless of whether it makes me appear better than people, or "cooler" or anything like that. Boasting can only work if one has an ego, and I do my best to try to destroy mine.
And I admire that.
That's exactly the point, to not have any questions. We try to see things without thought. We try not to comprehend or even translate it into anything near thought. Sorcerers see things at the essense, before thought and everything superficial is added. No words, pictures, or sounds, just direct information. Of course, it can be translated into something comprehensible, but as soon as that happens, most of the information is lost.
Ah, I see. It is like the Zen concept of No-Mind. There is only perception and not thought. There is just seeing, no seer and nothing seen. There is just hearing, no hearer and nothing heard. This is something I can understand.
But surely you must have some method of separating truth from fiction? Do new probabilities interact with the current set of probabilites acting on our realities in a compatible and harmonic manner?
But, to reiterate. You said that many magicians were reckless and wasteful of their skills. How do you propose to remedy this? Far be it for something with confidence such as yourself to propose a problem without a solution in mind.
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Original post: NecroMage
Rin, you hit the nail right on the head with that one. It is exactly like Zen
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]But surely you must have some method of separating truth from fiction? Do new probabilities interact with the current set of probabilites acting on our realities in a compatible and harmonic manner?[/QUOTE]
Of course there is a method, and it is extremely simple. Fiction is the pure product of one's mind/thought. Without thought, there can be no fiction. If you percieve something and think nothing, that something must be true. It cannot be fabricated because nothing fabricates it.
It becomes more complicated with the introduction of constructs. When you create something from energy, it can become indescernible from our world, from "reality". In which case it is no longer really fiction, as it is as real as anything. Note that I'm not exactly reffering to psi-ball type constructs, rather to the abstract notion of a construct.
As for the solution... it really is a difficult nut to crack, perhaps why I brought it up in the first place. I will focus on this and try to see the answer, and then I will try to put it into something we can discuss.
Rin, you hit the nail right on the head with that one. It is exactly like Zen
[QUOTE=Rin Daemoko]But surely you must have some method of separating truth from fiction? Do new probabilities interact with the current set of probabilites acting on our realities in a compatible and harmonic manner?[/QUOTE]
Of course there is a method, and it is extremely simple. Fiction is the pure product of one's mind/thought. Without thought, there can be no fiction. If you percieve something and think nothing, that something must be true. It cannot be fabricated because nothing fabricates it.
It becomes more complicated with the introduction of constructs. When you create something from energy, it can become indescernible from our world, from "reality". In which case it is no longer really fiction, as it is as real as anything. Note that I'm not exactly reffering to psi-ball type constructs, rather to the abstract notion of a construct.
As for the solution... it really is a difficult nut to crack, perhaps why I brought it up in the first place. I will focus on this and try to see the answer, and then I will try to put it into something we can discuss.
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Original post: Rin Daemoko
Yes, because if you see something and think nothing, then you are not projecting your biases upon that something. You are allowing it to become empty of personal projections, thus, it shows only what it is.
Yes, yes. Infinite correlation. Divine made manifest. How wonderful!
I agree. Solving sub-social situations is never easy. First one must devise a viable solution, and then one must implement it. Of course the latter is far more difficult to do than the former. I look forward to reading your thoughts.
NecroMage wrote:Of course there is a method, and it is extremely simple. Fiction is the pure product of one's mind/thought. Without thought, there can be no fiction. If you percieve something and think nothing, that something must be true. It cannot be fabricated because nothing fabricates it.
Yes, because if you see something and think nothing, then you are not projecting your biases upon that something. You are allowing it to become empty of personal projections, thus, it shows only what it is.
It becomes more complicated with the introduction of constructs. When you create something from energy, it can become indescernible from our world, from "reality". In which case it is no longer really fiction, as it is as real as anything. Note that I'm not exactly reffering to psi-ball type constructs, rather to the abstract notion of a construct.
Yes, yes. Infinite correlation. Divine made manifest. How wonderful!
As for the solution... it really is a difficult nut to crack, perhaps why I brought it up in the first place. I will focus on this and try to see the answer, and then I will try to put it into something we can discuss.
I agree. Solving sub-social situations is never easy. First one must devise a viable solution, and then one must implement it. Of course the latter is far more difficult to do than the former. I look forward to reading your thoughts.
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Original post: Ludi
Gosh, no, NecroMage, I'm not offended. I don't have anything to be offended about!
I'll shove some smilies in here to demonstrate that I'm not offended.
No, I spoke (wrote) bluntly because I get frustrated (not offended) by your posts, as I get frustrated by people who claim to have the truth for everyone, not just for themselves. I ask you how you can know it is the truth, and I'm not able to detect any answer in your posts, perhaps I'm overlooking it somewhere, except where you say it is a stupid question to ask for proof that what you say is the truth is the truth. No, it's not a stupid question. Scientists are asked to prove the truth (robustness) of their theories by demonstration, either equation or experiment. Is there a way you can demonstrate that this truth you know for everyone actually is the truth for everyone? You "feel" it is the truth? But others seem to feel it is not. If it's a feeling, doesn't that mean your feelings have gotten in the way of the information? You can't think it's the truth, you can't feel it's the truth, and you can't know it's the truth (because knowing is thinking) - so, how is it the truth?
What you claim to be able to do, perceive without thought, just isn't possible for humans - in my opinion. And don't go claiming you aren't human, or nobody will take you seriously. Of course, you wouldn't mind if people made fun of you, because you don't have an ego.
You say I'm spitting venom and not being "civilized." Oddly, people often say this when a person speaks bluntly, even when they are being very polite and using careful language. In order to be civilized, I should learn to not say what I mean, or I should learn to circumlocute more, I know it. Thank you for pointing it out. But you seem to be the one offended if you detect "venom" in my post. If you had simply been reading it, without thought or feeling, it would have been words without venom which wasn't there anyway, because symbols can't carry venom, being just meaningless marks until a thought or feeling is attached to them.
But, away from that...
What specifically are these dangers you speak of? Can you be very specific please? And why indeed you care?
Gosh, no, NecroMage, I'm not offended. I don't have anything to be offended about!
I'll shove some smilies in here to demonstrate that I'm not offended.
No, I spoke (wrote) bluntly because I get frustrated (not offended) by your posts, as I get frustrated by people who claim to have the truth for everyone, not just for themselves. I ask you how you can know it is the truth, and I'm not able to detect any answer in your posts, perhaps I'm overlooking it somewhere, except where you say it is a stupid question to ask for proof that what you say is the truth is the truth. No, it's not a stupid question. Scientists are asked to prove the truth (robustness) of their theories by demonstration, either equation or experiment. Is there a way you can demonstrate that this truth you know for everyone actually is the truth for everyone? You "feel" it is the truth? But others seem to feel it is not. If it's a feeling, doesn't that mean your feelings have gotten in the way of the information? You can't think it's the truth, you can't feel it's the truth, and you can't know it's the truth (because knowing is thinking) - so, how is it the truth?
What you claim to be able to do, perceive without thought, just isn't possible for humans - in my opinion. And don't go claiming you aren't human, or nobody will take you seriously. Of course, you wouldn't mind if people made fun of you, because you don't have an ego.
You say I'm spitting venom and not being "civilized." Oddly, people often say this when a person speaks bluntly, even when they are being very polite and using careful language. In order to be civilized, I should learn to not say what I mean, or I should learn to circumlocute more, I know it. Thank you for pointing it out. But you seem to be the one offended if you detect "venom" in my post. If you had simply been reading it, without thought or feeling, it would have been words without venom which wasn't there anyway, because symbols can't carry venom, being just meaningless marks until a thought or feeling is attached to them.
But, away from that...
What specifically are these dangers you speak of? Can you be very specific please? And why indeed you care?
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Original post: NecroMage
Touche, Ludi, I have fallen to the same enemy as you, and many others. Our past clouds our future, but let's try not to let it happen again.
Yes, you did speak bluntly rather than offensively, and due to my ego (which I could not control as well as I wanted at the moment) I took it in offense.
Moving forward, first of all, I seem to have used "feeling" in two seperate definitons that contradict each other. When I speak of "thoughts and feelings" I mean/meant thoughts and feelings from within me. In all other context, when I say feeling, I mean direct information.
Saying that percieving without thought is humanly impossible is correct, but by that, and only by that definition would I not be human. What is a human? What is humanly possible then?
Dictionary.com defines human as: "A member of the genus Homo and especially of the species H. sapiens" in the only definiton that does not use human within the definition
By this, obviously I am human. Of course this definition does not imply that humans think or percieve at all, much less how or with what they think or percieve.
As for the proof of my knowledge. What I speak of is beyond thought itself. Scientists can prove everything that abides by logic. This is beyond logic and thought, this is magic. Surely you understand. Scientists cannot prove magic and I am quite positive that had I been a scientist, I would not be able to prove any of what I know.
I can, perhaps, provide you with the tools so you can prove this to yourself. Not to mention that link I posted. It's really a good read, try it.
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The dangers I speak of... First of all, there is the very movement of Chaos/(substitute whatever word you call the "other" realm) to worry about. I myself, with all my experience and knowledge nearly fell prey to a small whirlpool some time ago. I survived only by a hair's width of odds. If a magician catches the wrong current they could be carried off and never return. There are many dangers even without other entities.
On the other hand, with the entities, it is far more dangerous. I have been to a little nook that seemed to be a hang-out spot for some of the worst creatures one can ever encounter. They would play games with their victim and then, at the peak of it, torture and kill them. The torture would last for an excruiatingly long time. There are also "batteries" out there. Some sick little creature would gather up as many people as they could and plug them in to generate energy.
The victims would be too weak to escape and would constantly live in this horrible cycle, until either fate or time would free them. Usually it would take millenia.
Why do I care? I care because I choose to care, because if I didn't choose to care about this, why would I choose to care about anything? And if I chose not to care about anything... well that sort of takes the point out of existance.
I know its all fake, all bullshit, that everything is really meaningless in actuality, but we exist to put the meaning there, so I put the meaning in this.
Touche, Ludi, I have fallen to the same enemy as you, and many others. Our past clouds our future, but let's try not to let it happen again.
Yes, you did speak bluntly rather than offensively, and due to my ego (which I could not control as well as I wanted at the moment) I took it in offense.
Moving forward, first of all, I seem to have used "feeling" in two seperate definitons that contradict each other. When I speak of "thoughts and feelings" I mean/meant thoughts and feelings from within me. In all other context, when I say feeling, I mean direct information.
Saying that percieving without thought is humanly impossible is correct, but by that, and only by that definition would I not be human. What is a human? What is humanly possible then?
Dictionary.com defines human as: "A member of the genus Homo and especially of the species H. sapiens" in the only definiton that does not use human within the definition
By this, obviously I am human. Of course this definition does not imply that humans think or percieve at all, much less how or with what they think or percieve.
As for the proof of my knowledge. What I speak of is beyond thought itself. Scientists can prove everything that abides by logic. This is beyond logic and thought, this is magic. Surely you understand. Scientists cannot prove magic and I am quite positive that had I been a scientist, I would not be able to prove any of what I know.
I can, perhaps, provide you with the tools so you can prove this to yourself. Not to mention that link I posted. It's really a good read, try it.
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The dangers I speak of... First of all, there is the very movement of Chaos/(substitute whatever word you call the "other" realm) to worry about. I myself, with all my experience and knowledge nearly fell prey to a small whirlpool some time ago. I survived only by a hair's width of odds. If a magician catches the wrong current they could be carried off and never return. There are many dangers even without other entities.
On the other hand, with the entities, it is far more dangerous. I have been to a little nook that seemed to be a hang-out spot for some of the worst creatures one can ever encounter. They would play games with their victim and then, at the peak of it, torture and kill them. The torture would last for an excruiatingly long time. There are also "batteries" out there. Some sick little creature would gather up as many people as they could and plug them in to generate energy.
The victims would be too weak to escape and would constantly live in this horrible cycle, until either fate or time would free them. Usually it would take millenia.
Why do I care? I care because I choose to care, because if I didn't choose to care about this, why would I choose to care about anything? And if I chose not to care about anything... well that sort of takes the point out of existance.
I know its all fake, all bullshit, that everything is really meaningless in actuality, but we exist to put the meaning there, so I put the meaning in this.
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Original post: Lucid
No question is stupid, if asked in search of knowledge.
As a side note. I'm not in anyway trying to make you leave again. In some weird way, I actually enjoy your posts. My only suggestion is that you lighten up a bit. I've seen things that others here have not seen, and everyone here has seen things that I have not seen. Our realities, thoughts, and lives are all different. If we all believed and experienced the same things, then life would become very mundane.
This was exactly my point. While "astral sex" may not be my cup of tea, who are you to call these people "lowlife idiots pretending to know something about magic"? Most on this board did not agree with your dueling club idea, and thought you had been watching a little too much buffy, when you claimed to be a professional demon hunter. Does that give someone here the right to call you a lowlife idiot, simply because they do not agree with you?NecroMage wrote:I associated "mental sex" with something I heard long before on a chat room. It was a very unprofessional room, with a bunch of lowlife idiots pretending to know something about magic, and their highest subject seemed to be 'astral sex' so consequentially I made the association.
Well it is a stupid question in the first place
No question is stupid, if asked in search of knowledge.
As a side note. I'm not in anyway trying to make you leave again. In some weird way, I actually enjoy your posts. My only suggestion is that you lighten up a bit. I've seen things that others here have not seen, and everyone here has seen things that I have not seen. Our realities, thoughts, and lives are all different. If we all believed and experienced the same things, then life would become very mundane.
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Original post: Ludi
I'm glad I don't consider the ego to be the enemy. I have a positive Hindenburg of an ego.
I like Chaos, myself. I'm currently courting it.
*
I'm glad I don't consider the ego to be the enemy. I have a positive Hindenburg of an ego.
Where is this located?The dangers I speak of... First of all, there is the very movement of Chaos/(substitute whatever word you call the "other" realm) to worry about. I myself, with all my experience and knowledge nearly fell prey to a small whirlpool some time ago. I survived only by a hair's width of odds. If a magician catches the wrong current they could be carried off and never return. There are many dangers even without other entities.
I like Chaos, myself. I'm currently courting it.
Where are they located? What do they look/sound/smell like? I've never encountered a dangerous entity, myself.On the other hand, with the entities, it is far more dangerous. I have been to a little nook that seemed to be a hang-out spot for some of the worst creatures one can ever encounter. They would play games with their victim and then, at the peak of it, torture and kill them. The torture would last for an excruiatingly long time. There are also "batteries" out there. Some sick little creature would gather up as many people as they could and plug them in to generate energy.
How do you know this? oh, never mind, you can't tell me.The victims would be too weak to escape and would constantly live in this horrible cycle, until either fate or time would free them. Usually it would take millenia.
Can you explain this passage please? Are you being flippant, or serious? I feel I would virtually have to ask you the meaning of each word in the above sentence to have any idea what you are saying.I know its all fake, all bullshit, that everything is really meaningless in actuality, but we exist to put the meaning there, so I put the meaning in this.
*
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Original post: NecroMage
I do not like explaining every single word, but if I have to...
Instead of stupid perhaps I should have said, "Undefined", but I think the meaning was fairly clear.
Who am I to call them lowlife idiots? Well it was a fact that they were idiots, as they contradicted themselves at every statement, argued without reason, and acted like complete imbecils. They would be idiots regardless what they talked about, magical or not.
I do not think that I have behaved that way on this board, so that would not give anyone "right" to call me an idiot.
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Where are all those located? There are no words in any human language for me to tell you that. Our words only account for three dimensions, and those "places" are beyond them. As for how I know this, well, I've seen it/experienced it/been there. Or you can say Im full of shit, but then why are you listening to me.
Don Juan said something about how only we create any meaning in the world, and that is the philosophy I go by.
I do not like explaining every single word, but if I have to...
Instead of stupid perhaps I should have said, "Undefined", but I think the meaning was fairly clear.
Who am I to call them lowlife idiots? Well it was a fact that they were idiots, as they contradicted themselves at every statement, argued without reason, and acted like complete imbecils. They would be idiots regardless what they talked about, magical or not.
I do not think that I have behaved that way on this board, so that would not give anyone "right" to call me an idiot.
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Where are all those located? There are no words in any human language for me to tell you that. Our words only account for three dimensions, and those "places" are beyond them. As for how I know this, well, I've seen it/experienced it/been there. Or you can say Im full of shit, but then why are you listening to me.
Don Juan said something about how only we create any meaning in the world, and that is the philosophy I go by.
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Original post: Lucid
Said the pot to the kettle, "You're Black!"
No it was an opinion. Can you say opinion?NecroMage wrote: Who am I to call them lowlife idiots? Well it was a fact that they were idiots
, as they contradicted themselves at every statement, argued without reason, and acted like complete imbecils. They would be idiots regardless what they talked about, magical or not.
Said the pot to the kettle, "You're Black!"
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Original post: NecroMage
Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.
Most practicioners today are barely aware of each other much less a practicioner exponentially more powerful than themselves. Perhaps we could implement a modern invention for this purpose. We could create a sort of e-harmony for mages and teachers. Advanced magicians could get a student and train them as much as possible and then the students become advanced and could gain students of their own.
This would be far safer than learning solo, not to mention far more effective.
Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.
Most practicioners today are barely aware of each other much less a practicioner exponentially more powerful than themselves. Perhaps we could implement a modern invention for this purpose. We could create a sort of e-harmony for mages and teachers. Advanced magicians could get a student and train them as much as possible and then the students become advanced and could gain students of their own.
This would be far safer than learning solo, not to mention far more effective.
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Original post: different
out of all that i have read magicians take risk to do what they do. they willingly take these risk or they take them in ingnorance without a full understanding of what they are doing and the consequences of. Now i associate this with skateboarding (as i do this in my free time). I skateboard with the known risk that i might make a mistake and fall. in this i could break bones, have skrapes and bruises, rack myself so hard i become steril, or the risk of death (extreme case scenario). I willing risk the harm of my physical body to do something i enjoy. and when i do hurt myself i get up and try again. so then i just try it more carefully trying not to make the same mistake i made before. now as with magick its the same way. it comes with risk of physical or maybe even mental harm. thats the risk that a magican will have to willingly take in order to practice what they enjoy. now as for ignorance that should be stamped out altogether. i dont belive that you should practice anything before having a firm understanding of what might happen if you screw up. as for me this applies to psionics. You see i am a devote Christian that became interested in psionics. So i researched it and found out that it isnt religion oriented and is a skill that you can learn. Out of the research and study of it that i did i made the decision that i could practice psionics with out interfering my personal relationship with my God. As you see i studied to do away with the ignorance before i dove into the feild. its also kinda like putting your toe in the water to test the temperature before you dive in headfirst.
out of all that i have read magicians take risk to do what they do. they willingly take these risk or they take them in ingnorance without a full understanding of what they are doing and the consequences of. Now i associate this with skateboarding (as i do this in my free time). I skateboard with the known risk that i might make a mistake and fall. in this i could break bones, have skrapes and bruises, rack myself so hard i become steril, or the risk of death (extreme case scenario). I willing risk the harm of my physical body to do something i enjoy. and when i do hurt myself i get up and try again. so then i just try it more carefully trying not to make the same mistake i made before. now as with magick its the same way. it comes with risk of physical or maybe even mental harm. thats the risk that a magican will have to willingly take in order to practice what they enjoy. now as for ignorance that should be stamped out altogether. i dont belive that you should practice anything before having a firm understanding of what might happen if you screw up. as for me this applies to psionics. You see i am a devote Christian that became interested in psionics. So i researched it and found out that it isnt religion oriented and is a skill that you can learn. Out of the research and study of it that i did i made the decision that i could practice psionics with out interfering my personal relationship with my God. As you see i studied to do away with the ignorance before i dove into the feild. its also kinda like putting your toe in the water to test the temperature before you dive in headfirst.
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Original post: Rin Daemoko
[QUOTE=NecroMage]Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.[/QUOTE]
This makes sense. With the proper teacher to put teachings into proper context, magick and its ways can be made much more clear. It is the same way with any martial art, and most Buddhist traditions. However, as I said before, implementing the solution would be vastly difficult.
[QUOTE=NecroMage]Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.[/QUOTE]
This makes sense. With the proper teacher to put teachings into proper context, magick and its ways can be made much more clear. It is the same way with any martial art, and most Buddhist traditions. However, as I said before, implementing the solution would be vastly difficult.
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Original post: endor957
necromage, i apologize for the misunderstanding but kudo's to you for atleast taking your time to humbly explain why you've said what you've said.
so i'm going to withdraw what i've written.
take care
endor-
necromage, i apologize for the misunderstanding but kudo's to you for atleast taking your time to humbly explain why you've said what you've said.
so i'm going to withdraw what i've written.
take care
endor-
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Original post: Ludi
Well. ok, NecroMage. If you can't say where these threats take place or reside, I guess they aren't much of a threat, since apparently it isn't "here" where I am.
Thanks for the warnings though. Useless warnings really, since you can't say anything meaningful or helpful about the threats. But, I guess your heart is in the right place.
Well. ok, NecroMage. If you can't say where these threats take place or reside, I guess they aren't much of a threat, since apparently it isn't "here" where I am.
Thanks for the warnings though. Useless warnings really, since you can't say anything meaningful or helpful about the threats. But, I guess your heart is in the right place.
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Original post: Frater Manjet
[QUOTE=NecroMage]Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.
Most practicioners today are barely aware of each other much less a practicioner exponentially more powerful than themselves. Perhaps we could implement a modern invention for this purpose. We could create a sort of e-harmony for mages and teachers. Advanced magicians could get a student and train them as much as possible and then the students become advanced and could gain students of their own.
This would be far safer than learning solo, not to mention far more effective.[/QUOTE]This is hardly a new concept. There are schools all over. What about the G.'.D.'., O.T.O. and the A.'.A.'. ? plus various others like BOTA etc...
- VVV
[QUOTE=NecroMage]Ah! The solution just came to me. It is ever so simple. All one needs is a teacher, a mentor. Someone to look after them as they experiment or practice their wild deeds. Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.
Most practicioners today are barely aware of each other much less a practicioner exponentially more powerful than themselves. Perhaps we could implement a modern invention for this purpose. We could create a sort of e-harmony for mages and teachers. Advanced magicians could get a student and train them as much as possible and then the students become advanced and could gain students of their own.
This would be far safer than learning solo, not to mention far more effective.[/QUOTE]This is hardly a new concept. There are schools all over. What about the G.'.D.'., O.T.O. and the A.'.A.'. ? plus various others like BOTA etc...
- VVV
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Original post: Spes
If you want solution NecroMage I personally find there is one - you need to experience insanity but return to sanity, you need to face death but not die and most important - learn patience. Even then things woun't reveal themselves to you out of blue but this certainly helps a lot.
If you want solution NecroMage I personally find there is one - you need to experience insanity but return to sanity, you need to face death but not die and most important - learn patience. Even then things woun't reveal themselves to you out of blue but this certainly helps a lot.
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Original post: Arcanus Mysticus Spiritus
I think its been summed up enough...but...
necromage,
:lol: :roll:.....
The purpose in life is to grow and evolve.
How do we do this?
By sitting in a cupboard?
Everyone chooses a path,we all have the free will to choose the path we go down.
If Some choose to do magick ,and not do it properly,make mistakes etc.They are still learning from it.
To grow and evolve individually one must make mistakes!
Oh the shock/horror!.
I think i would be more worried if none of us made no mistakes.
ALSO,
Reality is relative. well everything is relative IMO.
Therefore whether life is serious or not,or whether we even choose to be serious or not really has no bearing on the outcome of our growth,to a point.
If someone stuffs up their whole existence by invoking something far too powerful or whatever,that is their tuff shit.
They have to live the consequences of their actions not you.
Might i suggest concentrating on your own growth and exploration if you dare be bold enough yourself to experiment.
Also along the lines of what die before death said,
I believe the universe/multiverse whatever holds in this "irreality"(lol i just thought of that word,hmm reality is an illusion and is relative..)
is made up of YIN/YANG balance.
For in science explains this too,for everyaction=reaction.
And in hermetica "as above,so below"
Therefore this universe needs these idiots or whatever ya want to call them,to maintain the balance...
Anyway i think everyone here has pretty much summed it up...
oh well.
I think its been summed up enough...but...
necromage,
:lol: :roll:.....
The purpose in life is to grow and evolve.
How do we do this?
By sitting in a cupboard?
Everyone chooses a path,we all have the free will to choose the path we go down.
If Some choose to do magick ,and not do it properly,make mistakes etc.They are still learning from it.
To grow and evolve individually one must make mistakes!
Oh the shock/horror!.
I think i would be more worried if none of us made no mistakes.
ALSO,
Reality is relative. well everything is relative IMO.
Therefore whether life is serious or not,or whether we even choose to be serious or not really has no bearing on the outcome of our growth,to a point.
If someone stuffs up their whole existence by invoking something far too powerful or whatever,that is their tuff shit.
They have to live the consequences of their actions not you.
Might i suggest concentrating on your own growth and exploration if you dare be bold enough yourself to experiment.
Also along the lines of what die before death said,
I believe the universe/multiverse whatever holds in this "irreality"(lol i just thought of that word,hmm reality is an illusion and is relative..)
is made up of YIN/YANG balance.
For in science explains this too,for everyaction=reaction.
And in hermetica "as above,so below"
Therefore this universe needs these idiots or whatever ya want to call them,to maintain the balance...
Anyway i think everyone here has pretty much summed it up...
oh well.
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Original post: Arcanus Mysticus Spiritus
crap, i missed reading page 2 an three of this thread before posting,nonetheless...please read my post anyway..it still has relevance...
crap, i missed reading page 2 an three of this thread before posting,nonetheless...please read my post anyway..it still has relevance...
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Original post: Cloud Hex
This is my first and last post in this thread to you necromage, you do your thing I'll do mine and we'll leave it at that, you say what you say and I'll say what I'll.
GOOD DAY/NIGHT
This is my first and last post in this thread to you necromage, you do your thing I'll do mine and we'll leave it at that, you say what you say and I'll say what I'll.
GOOD DAY/NIGHT
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Original post: Serpentiferous
Having some type of mentor is the way that most of us achieve anything of significance, like astral travel, is it not?
Every magician not ready to strike out on their own should have someone to guide them, and more importantly to protect them. This is far too rare in our modern society, unfortunately enough.
Having some type of mentor is the way that most of us achieve anything of significance, like astral travel, is it not?
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Original post: NecroMage
Yes, mentorship is the easiest/most efficient path to anything and as such is almost necessary for some of the more difficult things. Probably that is the only solution possible to being safe and yet being able to experiment.
As for it being not my problem that idiots do magic, well it is true, but in actually nothing is my problem. I don't have to care about anything. Everything that is meaningful is so because I make it so.
I think everything that could be said about this has been pretty much said, so unless someone wants to add anything, I think this thread is pretty much finished.
Yes, mentorship is the easiest/most efficient path to anything and as such is almost necessary for some of the more difficult things. Probably that is the only solution possible to being safe and yet being able to experiment.
As for it being not my problem that idiots do magic, well it is true, but in actually nothing is my problem. I don't have to care about anything. Everything that is meaningful is so because I make it so.
I think everything that could be said about this has been pretty much said, so unless someone wants to add anything, I think this thread is pretty much finished.