Is magick manly?

[Occult Forum Archive]

Original post: Impossible

i have a question somewhat relative to the topic and i don't want to start a new thread so i'll just post it here.

does anybody else see the Family Unit as One Being?
the two sex organs are two pieces of One Organ?
the Male & Female are actually to parts of One Being, or One Person, the so-called Family Unit.
and furthermore, the Trinity that is Man, Woman, and Child (both & neither) is One Being.

does anybody else see it that way, or am i the only one?

[Occult Forum Archive]

Original post: Yog-Sothoth

i agree with you, as the kybalion says, maybe my translation is not so good, but i beleive it goes something like this: opposites touch, opposites are part of the same thing, opposites are just different in graduation" cold and hot are the same: temperature.
I beleive everything has a duality but this duality is one, thus making it non-dual.

[Occult Forum Archive]

Original post: MagiAwen

Is magic manly?

If the magician is your definition manly, of course. If not, then no. This sort of thing is quite subjective and relative to the one percieving the magician, I would think.

i have a question somewhat relative to the topic and i don't want to start a new thread so i'll just post it here.

does anybody else see the Family Unit as One Being?
the two sex organs are two pieces of One Organ?
the Male & Female are actually to parts of One Being, or One Person, the so-called Family Unit.
and furthermore, the Trinity that is Man, Woman, and Child (both & neither) is One Being.

does anybody else see it that way, or am i the only one?

One being? A family unit...usually considered as two parents and a child..can be considered an egregore, if they create one together...that is maybe as close as you get to "one being".

There is something to be said for the Unity of a man and woman though, I think.."sacred marriage".

Maybe I'm not mysterious/mystical enough to go on about these questions though.

Though I have to agree with Venefica...men, as a gender, can be just as mysterious and sexy as women...

[Occult Forum Archive]

Original post: Venefica

I think the question that have to be answered before one can answer whatever magick is manly or not is, what is manly? Is it manly to be a stay at home dad, or do one have to be a macho man? To me being manly is being strong, not necessary in body but in mind, having form principles and doing the best to care for and protect that witch means allot to you, mind you many off these things is involved in being womanly to. So what exactly is the quality we are looking for, what is being manly, in effect being close to the quintessential man and how do the quintessential man differ from the quintessential woman?

[Azzerac]

Ever since the earliest books I've read, they've all said the same thing:
"Heterosexual Men are Power Mongering Spell Casters" (paraphrased).

You bet your butt "Spellcasting is Manly"!

[Zelos]

Indeed, there is no manlier art than to directly use one's will to force an outcome... unless the one doing such is a woman... then, well, that leads to debate and confusion as to the manliness of the act...

[Enlilki]

Depends how you look at being manly... In todays age it is ok for men to wear pink shirts and be considered fashionable, to me it is wrong.
The whole fairy or faeiry thing? I know there is a spelling different to fairy but anyway... As a young girl (pre-teen or even teen) it is quite common for them to like fairies, is it manly for a man to like them? within magic I'm sure some kind of statistic would show women are more involved with the workings and belief.

Wicca itself is somewhat neutral but has more attraction for females.

Performing some kind of love spell or love ritual as being manly? It might be since it is accepted that everyone has the emotion.

At the end of the day there will be certain things that are just considered more manly, like some things are considered more feminine... then there is the unisex area and the outsiders who keep their strict perceptions of manly vs feminine.

So, there's my theory, I'm sure we all might fit into the above just a little.

[Shaam]

Magick is manly..
Magick is womanly..
Magick is both.

Male/female.....yin/yang......duality. There is both....separately...but both together.

Each man has female qualities.
Each female has male qualities.

I think we recognize this in each other...and also realize the yin/yang....the balance....the duality. Without this...we cannot see full spectrum...but only from one side or the other. By recognizing both within ourselves...it gives us vision..to 'see' more.

Can one man or one woman be the family unit...I think they can if needed. I was more or less for a number of years...as far as being the family unit...with parenting.

Any other definition of 'family unit'...as far as 'can both be one'...I might have to have a little bit of explaining definition on...to be sure...lol.

Men are macho
Women are macho

It is damaging to both to be macho separately. (Thots?)

[Venefica]

New forum, and new members hopefully. Just to get some life in here, what do you guys say we reopen this debate. So, is magick manly? I would say that it is neither manly or womanly, it just is, but various types of magick can be more suited to men or to women, but using magick do not make you a pussy, unless you belive in Odin and what He have said of course, for in Asatru magick if for women and is considered very unmanly. Odin Himself have been said to have said that no man could use it wiout shame. But unless you follow that faith then yes. Magick in my opinion can be manly.

[Vashta]

Mmmh, interesting points.

I suppose it does depend a lot on the type of magick you're using (or perhaps less the magick and more the paradigm).. A lot of Wiccans, for example, have a tendency to lean towards pure goddess-worship, which, depending how you interpret that statement, could be either or, but tends to lean towards feminine. Many Wiccans do neglect the green man to an extent.

[Shaam]

For myself, I could never see the real reasoning for the strictly goddess worship. To me, it would seem very limiting..and you'd be missing out on so much. The balance really wouldn't be there.

As far as maybe some magick being better suited to men....I'm not so sure. Mainly, I think that is more of personal choice dictated by society...as to what kind is 'proper' for either sex. An example would be Kitchen Witch...Hedge Witch...people see them more as women.

[Venefica]

I can fine see the motivation and reason for pure Goddess or God worshipping, however I in my personal opinion think it is imbalanced, we need both. But then pershaps others have different needs than I myself do. The feminine is a powerful thing, so is the masquline, and focusing on one thing tend to let one get better at that thing, however that is at the expense of flexibility.

[Asterion]

Magic is just as manly as kabbala, a bit gayer than astrology, but a whole lot butcher than hermetism...
so to answer this question, one must ponder... what is, in fact, Man himself?... ))

next question: can voudun be practiced by "crackers" too? is there such a thing as Papa Whity??

[VenusSatanas]

I prefer androgynous gods, and multi-gender magic :lol:

[Mist]

It doesn't mean that because a lot of the creatures around us have the male-female reproduction method, that we have to start labelling everything as male or female. It's like learning French grammar: they have male and female versions of words, but there is no point in using them (in my opinion) because they would most likely be able to understand what you are trying to say anyway.

If you really want to give a whole "manliness" value to the subject of magic(k), then hell I have no reason to stop you - even though I fail to see the relevance.

[Nahemah]

I don't see the relevance either.Defining what is meant by 'manly' in the OP,I guess,would be a good start.

If it's purely a gender reference then yes,magick is manly if executed by a man.Quid pro quo.

If it is inferred that 'manly' equals in a 'heterosexual male' sense then that opens a big bad ole can of worms,dosen't it?

That would take us into an argument that is frankly,both tired and old.[In my opinion,anyway]

It makes me want to ask:[tongue firmly in cheek,here]

Strength or Fortitude,which is more manly?

[Venefica]

If it's purely a gender reference then yes,magick is manly if executed by a man.Quid pro quo.

Do this mean knitting is manly if performed by a man? I am not saying that it is not, however in our society some activities have been seen as manly and some as feminine. Are there no gender to activities? Only to the practitioner?

[Rikoshi]

I would say magic is flavorful. And by that, I mean that different kinds of magic tend to have different essences to it.

Magick can be manly, or womanly, or genderless, or hermaphroditic depending on the particular magic used.

Women tend to be better intuitively, socially, then men- so intuitive things like future reading would probably tend to work better for them.

Likewise, men tend to be more task and action oriented, so more active, get it done type magic tends to work better for them.

So, I would say, some magic is more girly, some more guyish, and anyone can practice either art from either sex.

However, if I met a guy who did a lot of tarot reading, was into healing over casting, awful at warding, kitchen witch tendencies, very intuitive sort, evokes and invokes a goddess spirit, chances are I'd think he was kind of girly if the rest of his life didn't indicate otherwise. *shrug*

[Nahemah]

"Do this mean knitting is manly if performed by a man? I am not saying that it is not, however in our society some activities have been seen as manly and some as feminine. Are there no gender to activities? Only to the practitioner?"

Maybe the gender to activities is based on the observer's way of thinking,as much as or more than the practitioner's?

I tend to think that gender stereotyping holds people back,it can stop them from exploring and learning new things,discovering unknown skills and talents etc.

[Venefica]

I think that gender stereotypes that one can not escape from holds pepole back. But I also think that there is definite differences between the genders, so that some activities will be more linked to men and some will be more linked to women. I know that there is debate over this, but I think that there are more differences between men and women than the shape of our reproductive organs. I however think that gender generalities and statistics should not hold back someone who is different from the statistic norm of their sex.

Magick can be manly, or womanly, or genderless, or hermaphroditic depending on the particular magic used.

Women tend to be better intuitively, socially, then men- so intuitive things like future reading would probably tend to work better for them.

Likewise, men tend to be more task and action oriented, so more active, get it done type magic tends to work better for them.

I read somewhere a discussion on male oriented and female oriented magick. However if one thing is male or female oriented do not mean that pepole of the oposite sex can not or do not practice it. It is just about the methods used.

Female magick is more mild, like Wiccan rituals where Spirits and Gods are asked nicely for help, intuitive magick, magick which is more go with the flow are feminine. Masculine magick is more like many types Ceremonial magick where the practitioner stand and demand cooperation from Spirits and Gods and exerts their will on event. This magick is more direct, more goal oriented, more controlled. I think that explanation made allot of sense really, for that is how I see male and female energies.