How do we make this place more 'new person friendly'?

[Clockwork Ghost]

It seems like we have a whole bunch of people make accounts, write a couple of posts, an introduction, and then disappear forever more. How can we therefore make this place more condusive for beginners to post in, experienced people to share material in, and people who have gone to come back to?

Ive chosen to put this topic here in the beginners board in the hope that beginners will post what they need to see in order to stay here, or to feel welcomed. We already have resources written by experts, but if we had a wish list written by beginners on what they themselves would like to have then maybe it might see more people posting more, rather than either feeling overwhelmed by the place or feeling like their input simply wont be valued or whatever it is thats causing all these people to have such low post counts and then disappearances back into the aether...

Please feel free to post below, moderators feel free to move this elsewhere, regular forum members feel free to do little song and dance routines or whatever, I dunno... [grin]

[Madavascus]

Good question... difficult to answer, because I think most everyone have different intentions when they join an online forum about occultism. Some just register because they have a particular question in mind ("How do I summon demon 'X'?" or "What does this symbol mean?"), some just like to read what others say (and lurk), while others like myself enjoy the fellowship felt in discussing with other occultists, and learning from them. Occasionally we may have something good to share with others that may potentially lead to a good discussion.

Maybe a lot of people who come to this forum are just looking for a good place to share what they know with the rest of the occult community, and so they wait for a good time to do so, and eventually leave when they don't feel they've found the right venue for their information...

Maybe we could come up with some controversial topics and have debates about them? Controversies usually attract and entertain crowds. [smile]

The forum, I think mostly due to its name, attracts a good number of new people, so it's good that we think about this. By the way, I like to see constructive-minded individuals like yourself on these forums. It's very refreshing, and I commend you for it! [thumbup]

[Taiyounoryu]

I'd like to see this forum grow as well. It's really a good place to learn, and has helped me a fair deal. It's a good place to start reading on a variety of practices (:
If we make this forum a little more tight knit and friendly I'm sure the numbers will pick back up.

To any beginners reading this, most members here are happy to help with any questions. Myself included, if I get any PM's I'll be happy to help how I can. [wink]

[Clockwork Ghost]

The forum, I think mostly due to its name, attracts a good number of new people, so it's good that we think about this. By the way, I like to see constructive-minded individuals like yourself on these forums. It's very refreshing, and I commend you for it! [thumbup]

The problem is that there is another Occult Forums that also has a very large members base, but that seems to be rather more fluffy. I personally dont get into the concept of otherkin and vampires, for instance, and if someone told me of Occult Forums and I happened by the wrong forum I'd be turned off by finding discussion by people who thought they were really dragons trapped in the bodies of humans.

As for constructive minded people, its people like you and the other regulars here that keep me coming back - I've now read a good deal of the forum and commented on everything posted within the last couple of months that jumps out at me, so now it's down to the people, and luckily this place has a good collection of those to keep the interest levels up and the quality posts flowing.

And as for me, I'm nothing special - Im just someone whos been around for a long time and who has read and absorbed a great deal of material on the occult. I dont for the most part remember specifics, so you wont find me posting quality quotes and footnotes, but I do understand the meaning and intent of all that I've read, and I guess thats what matters. Everyone can achieve that, it just takes time and a concious decision not to be beaten by knowledge that doesnt seem to be obvious upon an initial reading.

[Rin]

I think the best thing you can do is just post as much as possible. Forum populations increase exponentially, if someone registers and only sees a new post every other day, they're going to drop the site off their 'check up on every day' list.

The more you post, the more active the forum becomes, and activity attracts new posters and makes them want to stick around.

Think of it like a party, when the party first starts it's dead, the dance floor is empty, there's hardly anyone there to talk to, so a lot of people who drop by to check it out end up leaving for something more active, but some will stay, and eventually the numbers build until the party is in full swing, then those who come later on will see what looks like a good time and jump in themselves.

[Clockwork Ghost]

I think the best thing you can do is just post as much as possible. Forum populations increase exponentially, if someone registers and only sees a new post every other day, they're going to drop the site off their 'check up on every day' list.

The more you post, the more active the forum becomes, and activity attracts new posters and makes them want to stick around.

Think of it like a party, when the party first starts it's dead, the dance floor is empty, there's hardly anyone there to talk to, so a lot of people who drop by to check it out end up leaving for something more active, but some will stay, and eventually the numbers build until the party is in full swing, then those who come later on will see what looks like a good time and jump in themselves.

Yeah, this is dead right, and I've noticed this place is getting busier now that more people are posting to it with more frequency. The problem exists though that when there isnt anything left for people to comment on they stop posting, so we maybe need more new topics? What do you think? I could start a few new threads, and I'm sure other people here could too, it just really depends on what people really want to talk about, which is a curse of all forums I guess - finding interesting topics that wont just die after the first couple of replies.

[Rin]

Absolutely yeah, I'd love to create some threads but I have trouble coming up with decent topics for discussion sometimes because I'm so new (or at least recently returned) to all this. That said, there have been a lot of questions buzzing through my mind the last few days, maybe I should post them to see if I can garner up some answers.

[Clockwork Ghost]

Absolutely yeah, I'd love to create some threads but I have trouble coming up with decent topics for discussion sometimes because I'm so new (or at least recently returned) to all this. That said, there have been a lot of questions buzzing through my mind the last few days, maybe I should post them to see if I can garner up some answers.

Yeah, that would be an awesome thing to do, Rin. I think thats the key thing that makes a good forum great - the feeling that people can post questions freely without fear of being shot down or belittled. Hopefully nobody feels that way here - I know that the forum moderators would stomp on anyone who started abusing anyone for asking questions, because that just wouldnt be on.

[Rin]

It's not so much I'm worried about being shot down as it's just hard to sort out exactly what I think I need to know and where I think I need to go next. It's hard stepping back onto the path after getting lost in the woods for over half a decade, so to speak :p But I'll think it over and post a few today.

[weezyfosheezy]

As the least knowledgeable about the occult in general basically what keeps people coming back is new stuff to discuss. It is very occulty and current events/issues are not being talked about. Also all of the topics are very deep into right away. Dont know if many people are willing to look up a hundred things while reading to get a hope at understanding.

I joined mostly to get a different viewpoint from people with a different perspective then I've seen before.

[Ekatl]

I mostly lurk, but it generally happens on forums that there will be a bunch of people with one single post, because they really wanted to know if they could summon Pikachu for an infernal hug.
Also, there's a ton of archives, so often, questions I have were answered a while back, and I don't make a thread.

[Clockwork Ghost]

Also, there's a ton of archives, so often, questions I have were answered a while back, and I don't make a thread.

Yeah, there are rather a massive number of old posts, but I dont think that should stop people from asking questions, just in case the question has already been asked - especially if that question was asked ages ago. Hells, If I had to trawl back through the forum to check if something had already been said I'd never post at all... [grin]

[Rin]

Yeah I never understood the whole 'go back and find it in the archives!' attitude which you find on some forums. If it's not on the first few pages, then I think it's more than reasonable to start up a new discussion.

[Madavascus]

I think the best thing you can do is just post as much as possible. Forum populations increase exponentially, if someone registers and only sees a new post every other day, they're going to drop the site off their 'check up on every day' list.

The more you post, the more active the forum becomes, and activity attracts new posters and makes them want to stick around.

Think of it like a party, when the party first starts it's dead, the dance floor is empty, there's hardly anyone there to talk to, so a lot of people who drop by to check it out end up leaving for something more active, but some will stay, and eventually the numbers build until the party is in full swing, then those who come later on will see what looks like a good time and jump in themselves.

I agree, Rin. That is the essential ingredient.

As the least knowledgeable about the occult in general basically what keeps people coming back is new stuff to discuss. It is very occulty and current events/issues are not being talked about. Also all of the topics are very deep into right away. Dont know if many people are willing to look up a hundred things while reading to get a hope at understanding.

I joined mostly to get a different viewpoint from people with a different perspective then I've seen before.

What do you mean, Weezy, that we should go more into current events and deeper topics of occultism, yet be a little less obscure?

[weezyfosheezy]

Well they talk about things I have to look up constantly and read quite a bit to understand in the slightest. It can be really hard for someone to decipher if they haven't been studying occult for years.

As about current events it is just 99% of the material here is strictly occult. Why not add another acset to the forum and talk about current events. Or maybe whats happening with you forum topic. A forum doesn't have to be strictly business this is to reach a larger population mind you and not saying what is good or bad, but it would make it more new person friendly.

[dRider]

What I've always enjoyed reading is good, active discussions or people's individual practices and experiences. I will warn though, something I've seen in my own ventures, that if there's a 20-page thread, they either read the first page or the last couple, but few read the whole thing, to know exactly what's what. A variety of topics on a variety of subjects is useful. But then again, if there's a hundred topics, they get lost in the sea so to speak.

Best case-scenario, an organizational revamp of what we've got now (so that it'll look like less to have to poke through) might spur more activity, but that's a lot of work. Personally, it looks like people who really want information, true followers of truth and growth, will do well here as they usually do wherever they go. People who are looking to poke and not do a whole lot of work won't, as they usually do, and late bloomers and lurkers will come around eventually.

Just remember that many a great system has doomed their originality through questions of how to attract more newcomers and starters to the occult. Just look at World of Warcraft. They were awesome the first five or seven years, but have gradually went downhill since they started preferring new players to old ones. My three-and-a-half cents.

[Clockwork Ghost]

Just remember that many a great system has doomed their originality through questions of how to attract more newcomers and starters to the occult. Just look at World of Warcraft. They were awesome the first five or seven years, but have gradually went downhill since they started preferring new players to old ones. My three-and-a-half cents.

Yeah, thats very true too - like when people go out of their way to attract new friends and end up losing the ones they have, or when companies try to attract new business but lose their old customers because they dont feel valued any more.

I guess that we're also very important here, so we should be concentrating on what we want to see too, more so even that what we think would attract new members maybe. I personally just like seeing new posts up when I sign on in the mornings, and like having a chance to respond to interesting threads - it doesnt really worry me if theyre magic or mundane, or whether theyre advanced or beginner. To that end I'll do my bit to keep the posting up and the posting interesting and just go from there. [thumbup]

[Madavascus]

Well they talk about things I have to look up constantly and read quite a bit to understand in the slightest. It can be really hard for someone to decipher if they haven't been studying occult for years.

As about current events it is just 99% of the material here is strictly occult. Why not add another acset to the forum and talk about current events. Or maybe whats happening with you forum topic. A forum doesn't have to be strictly business this is to reach a larger population mind you and not saying what is good or bad, but it would make it more new person friendly.

Thank you for clarifying your meaning, Weezy. As for the complexity of user-submitted content, I don't see how this could be changed apart from asking that user to clarify his meaning or simplify his post when you reply. Being faced with such complexity can be a rewarding learning experience we readers...

I believe there is a board opened to current events and such. I'm very interested in what's happening in the world yet I don't seem to translate that into this forum for some reason.

Just remember that many a great system has doomed their originality through questions of how to attract more newcomers and starters to the occult. Just look at World of Warcraft. They were awesome the first five or seven years, but have gradually went downhill since they started preferring new players to old ones. My three-and-a-half cents.

Good point dRider... WoW veteran here... Very true. [confused]

[Nahemah]

Maybe we could come up with some controversial topics and have debates about them? Controversies usually attract and entertain crowds.

I luv this idea! [thumbup]
We had a debate sub forum in the troll pit on a previous forum I was at and I've seen it in other places too.
I was chair of my School debating society and I really enjoyed it .I believe in following the commonly used rules for constructive debate: logical fallacies and other derailment tools getting given the scorn they deserve,while allowing for free flow of discussion around the subject being debated.
Moderating a folder like this can be a tough call,though.Impartiality is key for those with banhammers at their fingertips especially,I find.

We can discuss this further too and if folks are interested let me know.

[cool] Many other good points and commentary here too,cheers everybody. [cool]

I would like to reiterate also that Case nailed it:re the mods here taking a dim view of harassing or otherwise flaming other members,it's not on and we don't let it pass unnoticed.
If we don't see it ,flag it/report it for us,or pm me or Dodaive.

Weezy,please feel free to start any topics you'd like to see here.We can create sub forums or folders for non Occult interests.Again,folks let me or Dodaive know what you want and if we can,we will accomodate your needs and wants as much as possible. [thumbup]

[Nahemah]

Ekatl wrote:Also, there's a ton of archives, so often, questions I have were answered a while back, and I don't make a thread.

Yeah, there are rather a massive number of old posts, but I dont think that should stop people from asking questions, just in case the question has already been asked - especially if that question was asked ages ago. Hells, If I had to trawl back through the forum to check if something had already been said I'd never post at all... [grin]
Nothing is Everything. Everything is Nothing.

Agreed Case.The archives are an excellent reference tool,but it's fine to ask old questions again as information gets added to/overlaid/debunked and corrected etc. And we learn more and extrapolate on previous knowledge and understanding all the time,so fire away Ekatl.It's welcomed.

[Rin]

Another thought I just had when looking down the front page is that there are a lot of different boards, which seems like it could be detrimental in a few ways. Firstly, it spreads discussion rather thin, secondly, it can make it tricky to pick which board you want to put your post in to attract the right response, and thirdly some of them seem a little redundant. eg:

Healing
Reiki, Ayurveda, channeled healing, energy healing, auric healing

Seems like it could easily fit under and be merged with:

Psychicism
Astral travel, astral projection, Psionics, telepathy, clairvoyance, telekinesis, DMILS etc

Likewise with Shamanism and Indigenous Beliefs.

Life Extension and Immortality doesn't seem to be getting any use at all, and

Spirituality
Emergent and individual spirituality, magico-spiritual eclecticism, noetic sciences and holistic healing

Seems a unnecessary when there's already General Theology and Eastern Faith.

It can just seem a bit overwhelming to newcomers, both those new to the forum and those new to the occult in general as well. A slightly more streamlined setup would make things easier and concentrate the discussion a little more.

[Clockwork Ghost]

Another thought I just had when looking down the front page is that there are a lot of different boards, which seems like it could be detrimental in a few ways. Firstly, it spreads discussion rather thin, secondly, it can make it tricky to pick which board you want to put your post in to attract the right response, and thirdly some of them seem a little redundant... A slightly more streamlined setup would make things easier and concentrate the discussion a little more.

Yeah, I agree Rin - there is a fair bit of redundancy here. Hopefully the Administrator who looks after such things will come back one day and might be amiable to our wishes enough to clear up the boards a little. That said, maybe you should post a new topic in the Wish List board with your ideas and let Nahemah put it forward for discussion for if that does occur? Still, its not as bad as some forums Ive seen that have in excess of eighty sub-boards - at least we group things like Reiki and Auric Healing together and dont give them their own sub-boards, for instance. I know its a bit of a balancing act, working out what people want to talk about abnd where its best put and grouped, but I'm with you that things could be grouped a bit better here.

[Rin]

Yeah I've seen some pretty terrible examples too :p It's usually one of the first things that turns me off a forum.

Good idea about posting it over in the wish list, I'll do that when I have a moment.

[Madavascus]

...Life Extension and Immortality doesn't seem to be getting any use at all...

I always watch that category in case one of MacGregor Mathers' "Secret Chiefs" posts in it, and reveals how they could live for hundreds of years... [clown]

[Nahemah]

...That said, maybe you should post a new topic in the Wish List board with your ideas and let Nahemah put it forward for discussion ...

Yes.I think the boards could use some collation and refinement too,though I would argue against merging Spirituality with any Theological type of folder,as it is a pan human quality,not just confined to those with theistic mindsets. [grin]

All ideas and input regarding this are very welcome and will be taken into consideration,a new topic is a great idea,we are getting a lot of feedback here and it is excellent to see members take in interest in shaping the environment. [yay]

I want to actually expand Shamanism with some sub forums,rather than merge it anywhere,I 'd like Urban and Modern in there with Ancient and Tribal and so on.I work within this spectrum most of the time,so have a lot to share,from a Northern perspective,lol and I also despise the Harnerism and Pseudo NA tripe so freely available elsewhere online,so I don't want to see us get hit with the fluff either.It's obvious there is a big interest in Castaneda/MesoAmerican Shamanic practice hereabouts,so that should be taken into account also and we could do a lot with the folder,in a positive fashion.It will take a bit of consideration,I think.

More on that later,though.

I have contacted Vashta,who I know has been very busy IRL recently.We will discuss and attend to this and other matters raised, that require his input as soon as he responds,hopefully. [thumbup]