Is there something wrong with Nazi swastika?

[astrolabgoz9881]

No fuck, for the first, last and every time it's something wrong in peoples' heads.
If you can't find a book or chair in which you will condemn all the blasphemy and awfulness of Nazism in your free time don't call a good symbol of luck "the perverted Nazi swastika rotated 90 degrees wrong" in every book I read. Unlike crimes of Third Reich Nazis (after all I'm a Mediterrainean Slavonic mix whose soldier grandpa was shot by Germans for being against Nazism, so I can spit spit on swastika, yuck brush off my tongue...) the swastika was totally okay, and I have no idea who gave credit to Nazis to use that prolly neolithic Germanic symbol on their state's flag... but there is nothing really wrong with the swastika they used IMO, change it's colors it's no more the same swastika in the same German flag colors.
If someone used a dragon on his medieval shield and abused many serfs, should I think dragons are wrongly represented in European traditions?

[manofsands]

I agree.
Its too bad things work that way.

Its not entirely unlike drinking too much tequila one night and not being able to drink it again. Or watching 'Scrubs' to bring yourself down from a blazing acid trip (it helped but I haven't been able to watch it since).... Actually that probably isn't anything like said topic. Never mind.

No fuck, for the first, last and every time it's something wrong in peoples' heads.

I want this as a bumper sticker.

[astrolabgoz9881]

Lol, ur right. Thanks.

I've been seeing and will be seeing bad perverted Nazi swastika theories serious peepz that could be investing serious resources in anti-Nazi works also serious, put in every book. Aw, that swastika is really bad...
It is that people speak about swastika as how they feel about it, and for such a case I say - Ya know what, everyone can feel, try thinking and your mind will say the thing ur the most scared of, NAZIS HAD AN AWSUM FLAG! Then make balance between what you think and what you feel and you will begin evolving, adoring nature for its pure being as is, free of any less natural mental constructs of any crazy nation and society... And you shall see how anything including a conspired egotism of an individual can be made out constructively and useful.

[astrolabgoz9881]

I will recall of a political leader from Balkans who ended up in War Crimes Court, very famous. I had quite a sympathy for him as a child.
But one day he said from the War Crimes Tribunal, "The Tribunal staff is wearing inquisition robes (of Latin tradition origin)." And as a result I began losing my own view of those robes. I began percieving them differently. It has an explanation in human cognitive processes, but wtf, those robes are excellent. If I imagine a situation in which dirty Serbian law system trials me to a death sentence while I'm not guilty, those robes would make my last days, because indeed they are cool.
Screw what God gave you and how he made you when you don't see the greatest significance of all to hold your own experience the most valuable to you with all your heart taking care nothing others' interferes with your heart and mind until you gain control over yourself as a unique specimen, so unique and the most important to yourself before and after anything that you have to keep yourself pure or you will involve!

[asterik]

what is a swastika?

It has nothing to do with Nazi, lool, It is an old asien figure and actually has 2 sides, you know?

One for the connecting the other the repelling....?!

[manonthepath]

I have a swastika tattooed on the head of my dick.... wanna see?

[Ramscha]

I have a swastika tattooed on the head of my dick.... wanna see?

Is this meant to work as a way of contraception?

[Sypheara]

Wat

[astrolabgoz9881]

Nooooo.... Ramscha it means his Dich ist der Herr Feldmarschal Glanzkopf die Dich mit grosse rank in der Staadtaffair a.k.a Dich komandier. Or his Dich ist just a crosshairs dude, a Cockney reject and used 2 b a Skinhead back in 80s. We gonna find out if we summon dead Sham 69 members and dey heil his dich!

[Desecrated]

For me as a european, the swastika will forever be linked with the nazis.
I know it's origin but symbols/words change over time.

[astrolabgoz9881]

For me as a european, the swastika will forever be linked with the nazis.
I know it's origin but symbols/words change over time.

Or Asatru/Odinism

[Ramscha]

Nooooo.... Ramscha it means his Dich ist der Herr Feldmarschal Glanzkopf die Dich mit grosse rank in der Staadtaffair a.k.a Dich komandier. Or his Dich ist just a crosshairs dude, a Cockney reject and used 2 b a Skinhead back in 80s. We gonna find out if we summon dead Sham 69 members and dey heil his dich!

Dein Deutsch musst du noch aufpolieren, mein Guter Für einen Muttersprachler reicht es noch nicht.

For me as austrian the swastika is a difficult symbol. However, I found a rather easy way to go around the trouble. Hitler changed the angle of the swastika to make it the Hakenkreuz, if you look at the banners and symbols, the angle is different. The indian version looks like it is standing while the nazi version looks more like it is rotating (and therefore more aggressive and dynamic as it was intendet back then). Though I hesitate to post pictures because of the forum policy.

It might have been just a few years, but in the mind of the people a certain symbol gained a certain meaning and the meaning of a symbol is its power. It is not easy to eradicate something like that. School education in austria and germany didn't help much either. When you enter the 9th class in high school probably the only thing you will learn about in history and religion is about the nazi time and related topics. To learn about mistakes out of history is important, but in both germany and austria it goes so far as that the next generation is close to shame itself when it comes to national identity. This is in no way meant to promote any aggressive form of nationalism, but what I and a big part of my generation learned when we went to school was the pure anti-thesis of national identity.

Sorry for straying off topic

Ramscha

[astrolabgoz9881]

Ramscha I agree with you. German culture is one brilliant culture and shame what's been done with it! Same problem they have in Serbia (Germany and Serbia were the victims of the same fate for a long time) the national identity is ruined. The new generations are taking role of victim and the culture is the agressor!

Perhaps for the part about hakenkreutz, well I've been into traditional witchcraft and I had a Romanian witch for a teacher in classes and she taught me about European symbols. I consider Nazi swastika hybrid symbol consisted of lozenge (fertility, success) and solar cross (astral protection). Just theory.

And yes the point of the topic shud b no matter how whatever evil or wrong were Nazis they weren't that stupid to jinx themselves by putting a bad symbol on themselves ahh.. [stare]

[Desecrated]

For me as a european, the swastika will forever be linked with the nazis.
I know it's origin but symbols/words change over time.

Or Asatru/Odinism

asatru for me is just a bunch of new age.

[astrolabgoz9881]

[eek] I actually used 2 view them as reconstructionists.

[Desecrated]

[eek] I actually used 2 view them as reconstructionists.

Reconstructing from what? Some Icelandic poetry written hundreds of years after all evidence was destroyed.

Honestly, the world-view presented in the eddas doesn't match the archaeological evidence we have.
In the eddas we are presented with a unity, almost like the greek mythology. Just in Sweden we had several different cultures, with different religions, different languages and there is no proof that a pantheon existed.

[Nahemah]

asatru for me is just a bunch of new age

Plainly spoken, lol, but agreed.

I have Ginfaxi, an Icelandic charm, as my avvie [look right...]

It's no older than erm... sometime 1700's I think, but it has significance nonetheless. And a personal connection for me, that came from there to here, over time.

[UPG,aint it great, lol.]

Any way...back on topic again. [arrowright]

Hitler changed the angle of the swastika to make it the Hakenkreuz, if you look at the banners and symbols, the angle is different. The indian version looks like it is standing while the nazi version looks more like it is rotating (and therefore more aggressive and dynamic as it was intendet back then). Though I hesitate to post pictures because of the forum policy.

Ramscha, post away, it would be most helpful and we don't mind. This is a significant discussion and it's germane to the subject.

I also pointed at my avvie, as it's relative, four armed crosses and all, with bars and hangers and such. [shock2]

Also think about the fylfot and Brigid's cross, perhaps?

[Ramscha]

Hitler changed the angle of the swastika to make it the Hakenkreuz, if you look at the banners and symbols, the angle is different. The indian version looks like it is standing while the nazi version looks more like it is rotating (and therefore more aggressive and dynamic as it was intendet back then). Though I hesitate to post pictures because of the forum policy.

Ramscha, post away, it would be most helpful and we don't mind. This is a significant discussion and it's germane to the subject.

I also pointed at my avvie, as it's relative, four armed crosses and all, with bars and hangers and such. [shock2]

Also think about the fylfot and Brigid's cross, perhaps?

Hmm, well, if we go that way I guess we can trace the symbol over nearly the whole globe. Reaching from the use as a letter for 10000 fold luck or virute to carvings in the area of the vinca culture 6000-6500 years ago to some indian turtle shell ornaments in Mississipi. Its meaning can vary a great deal depending in time and region.

No to come to the pictures:
This is the chinese Falun Gong emblem:


And as comparison here the famous Nazi emblem, black cross in white circle on red ground:


Ramscha

[astrolabgoz9881]

You are right Ramscha, the Nazi swastika is rotated 90 degrees and pointing deosil. Apart from lozenge, could it be a portal? Like a way to open an astral doors to something? And so on...

Speaking of Slavs and/or Vinca (Serbia, Romania, South Hungary...) so far I know swastika is present on their Easter eggs. Both clockwise and conterclockwise used. And there is like thousands of customs and rituals around Easter and Christmas in Serbia. More for Christmas as traces of Slavic Koledo (Kolada) - Winter Solstice - are still present, there are cakes or breads made in shape of swastika. Svastika (swastika) is also a sibling's name over there.

One fact many historians and so on abused when speaking of "stealing swastika by Nazis" is that the symbol is all present in every culture, therefore it also used to be Germanic and Teutonic symbol which is evidented. The question is who and why chosen that symbol and not some other. And after all it doesn't have to bring bad luck, whatmore swastika should always be lucky at least for Hindu and Chinese practitioners. It should be a good symbol, perhaps it was abused by Nazis, also doesn't have 2 be. At all.

An yes to add to the point - what was he abuse? Abuse of swastika? Indeed they have abused humanity, they have abused lives, they abused death... they abused the Nature! Aren't we all the same... looking for a symbol, a tool, and object to drive and channel our frustration into. Most people's sexual energy is clogged and disbalanced and we are going in the circle.

[grimmos]

I don't know about Nazis but I got a few things against eric for damaging my oil and wine he speaks on behalf of 1 million witches

[asterik]

Not to educate anybody, but to share is that I have a "luck charm" from a temple in Japan called Omamori and its form is pointed to the left. As pointed out, to discredit this symbol to any nation in Europe is not really super smart. Drawing other forms of a pentagram is rather more difficult that the simple forms of this cross either being it be pointed to the left or to the right. To the right is to draw or collect and the left form is considered to be repelling. According to history is the figure most certain to my understanding from the far East.

[manonthepath]

Nooooo.... Ramscha it means his Dich ist der Herr Feldmarschal Glanzkopf die Dich mit grosse rank in der Staadtaffair a.k.a Dich komandier. Or his Dich ist just a crosshairs dude, a Cockney reject and used 2 b a Skinhead back in 80s. We gonna find out if we summon dead Sham 69 members and dey heil his dich!

Dein Deutsch musst du noch aufpolieren, mein Guter Für einen Muttersprachler reicht es noch nicht.

For me as austrian the swastika is a difficult symbol. However, I found a rather easy way to go around the trouble. Hitler changed the angle of the swastika to make it the Hakenkreuz, if you look at the banners and symbols, the angle is different. The indian version looks like it is standing while the nazi version looks more like it is rotating (and therefore more aggressive and dynamic as it was intendet back then). Though I hesitate to post pictures because of the forum policy.

It might have been just a few years, but in the mind of the people a certain symbol gained a certain meaning and the meaning of a symbol is its power. It is not easy to eradicate something like that. School education in austria and germany didn't help much either. When you enter the 9th class in high school probably the only thing you will learn about in history and religion is about the nazi time and related topics. To learn about mistakes out of history is important, but in both germany and austria it goes so far as that the next generation is close to shame itself when it comes to national identity. This is in no way meant to promote any aggressive form of nationalism, but what I and a big part of my generation learned when we went to school was the pure anti-thesis of national identity.

Sorry for straying off topic

Ramscha

Hey! I'm certainly no limey!

[astrolabgoz9881]

Hey! I'm certainly no limey!

[Bluebeard]

Yes. There is something wrong with Nazi swastika. It is the reversed, upside-down, sybol from Asian traditions, that means "peace". But you are right. Even the Asian, peace symbol, draws aggression and misunderstanding, when one uses it. Even the futhark runes, like the doppel sowilo, which was the SS symbol.

People who are untrained in symbols, meanings and usages of them... Always do just that. Well, only solution, to keep symbols and sigils concealed. Besides, if you think about it, this is one of the basic rules of these arts. You don't exactly flash them before the eyes of everyone, correct?? [shh]