Original post: Fr. Qim
[QUOTE=Specktackular]I've read Book 4, Magick In Theory & Practice, Magick Without Tears, Commentaries on The Holy Books, The Book of The Law, The Magick of Aleister Crowley (Duquette) and 777 since 1992-ish.
I wish you would elaborate further because I am seriously interested![/QUOTE]I shall do my best, as much as I understand.
Truth is solar. Like the bright sun at noon it cannot be stared at directly for it is beyond the physical and the rational. We must garb it in these shadowy luner things called words, their meaning ephemeral and ghost like. I shall do my best to garb them well, that my words may not twist too much in the shadow light of the mind.
Let us veiw man as a tripartate being. The child of two principles. One of these is the world, the universe, the enviroment. His wants and his restrictions, what he commonly thinks of as "willpower" are the reflections of a personality that is built up from his experiences in this world.
There is however another parent of his being. A force or way of going that preceeds his incarnation. Something that drives him forth, that sets the pattern of his life, that gives quickening to his breath. That is WILL. The wants and "needs" that he supposes he has point towards this WILL, for they are the child of it. The Universe is the mother, as the WILL the father.
But these wants and "needs" are their father veiwed through a glass darkly. By exploring the power and nature of one's being one begins to see what these mirad of forms point towards. One begins to suspect that there is a mover behind the glass of incarnation and the WILL is found to be.
Without this center any part of the personality is just as ephemerial as any other. With this center, many are seen to be simply distortions or false growths. Products of error and hasty conclusions they are trimmed and shaped, as a gardener molds a tree in the garden. They are brought in line with the true nature and shape of the tree, that it may be a testimony to truth and beauty for ever.
It could be said that I do not have my true will, but rather that my TRUE WILL has me.
What's your True Will?
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Specktackular
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]I shall do my best, as much as I understand.
Truth is solar. Like the bright sun at noon it cannot be stared at directly for it is beyond the physical and the rational. We must garb it in these shadowy luner things called words, their meaning ephemeral and ghost like. I shall do my best to garb them well, that my words may not twist too much in the shadow light of the mind.
Let us veiw man as a tripartate being. The child of two principles. One of these is the world, the universe, the enviroment. His wants and his restrictions, what he commonly thinks of as "willpower" are the reflections of a personality that is built up from his experiences in this world.
There is however another parent of his being. A force or way of going that preceeds his incarnation. Something that drives him forth, that sets the pattern of his life, that gives quickening to his breath. That is WILL. The wants and "needs" that he supposes he has point towards this WILL, for they are the child of it. The Universe is the mother, as the WILL the father.
But these wants and "needs" are their father veiwed through a glass darkly. By exploring the power and nature of one's being one begins to see what these mirad of forms point towards. One begins to suspect that there is a mover behind the glass of incarnation and the WILL is found to be.
Without this center any part of the personality is just as ephemerial as any other. With this center, many are seen to be simply distortions or false growths. Products of error and hasty conclusions they are trimmed and shaped, as a gardener molds a tree in the garden. They are brought in line with the true nature and shape of the tree, that it may be a testimony to truth and beauty for ever.
It could be said that I do not have my true will, but rather that my TRUE WILL has me.[/QUOTE]
OK, I do understand that, you put it in much more perspective. I guess what I meant when I said it sounds like "whatever you want to do" is that your True Will could be anything, right? Meaning, True Will is not limited to lofty goals of cosmic truth and service to others, necessarily. You could meet your HGA and find out your True Will was to be Hitler 2?
The idea of the higher self HGA, etc. gives the impression we might be talking about possession or something. Is the experience quite the opposite? (Of course, if you were possessed, how could I trust ya anyways
Just kidding.)
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]I shall do my best, as much as I understand.
Truth is solar. Like the bright sun at noon it cannot be stared at directly for it is beyond the physical and the rational. We must garb it in these shadowy luner things called words, their meaning ephemeral and ghost like. I shall do my best to garb them well, that my words may not twist too much in the shadow light of the mind.
Let us veiw man as a tripartate being. The child of two principles. One of these is the world, the universe, the enviroment. His wants and his restrictions, what he commonly thinks of as "willpower" are the reflections of a personality that is built up from his experiences in this world.
There is however another parent of his being. A force or way of going that preceeds his incarnation. Something that drives him forth, that sets the pattern of his life, that gives quickening to his breath. That is WILL. The wants and "needs" that he supposes he has point towards this WILL, for they are the child of it. The Universe is the mother, as the WILL the father.
But these wants and "needs" are their father veiwed through a glass darkly. By exploring the power and nature of one's being one begins to see what these mirad of forms point towards. One begins to suspect that there is a mover behind the glass of incarnation and the WILL is found to be.
Without this center any part of the personality is just as ephemerial as any other. With this center, many are seen to be simply distortions or false growths. Products of error and hasty conclusions they are trimmed and shaped, as a gardener molds a tree in the garden. They are brought in line with the true nature and shape of the tree, that it may be a testimony to truth and beauty for ever.
It could be said that I do not have my true will, but rather that my TRUE WILL has me.[/QUOTE]
OK, I do understand that, you put it in much more perspective. I guess what I meant when I said it sounds like "whatever you want to do" is that your True Will could be anything, right? Meaning, True Will is not limited to lofty goals of cosmic truth and service to others, necessarily. You could meet your HGA and find out your True Will was to be Hitler 2?
The idea of the higher self HGA, etc. gives the impression we might be talking about possession or something. Is the experience quite the opposite? (Of course, if you were possessed, how could I trust ya anyways
Just kidding.)-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Fr. Qim
The experience of my HGA, that I have had thus far, is not too disimilar to possesion in that it is outside of your normal, everyday consciousness. It is different in that it is not foriegn. It is more like falling in love, than being taken over, except that your lover lives in you, is always with you, is never waivering, never failing in his perfect passion for you. It is like....like....coming home.
Glad to be of service. That is correct in a certain sense, one's true will could theoretically be anything. That being said, every human being unique, conflict is either A) error from ignorance of one's path or B) sport, designed to further our growth through a particular form of martial love. The oppression of another is a statement of their lack of a true will, which denys your own right to it.Specktackular wrote:OK, I do understand that, you put it in much more perspective. I guess what I meant when I said it sounds like "whatever you want to do" is that your True Will could be anything, right? Meaning, True Will is not limited to lofty goals of cosmic truth and service to others, necessarily. You could meet your HGA and find out your True Will was to be Hitler 2?
HAHA. True you could notspecktackular wrote:The idea of the higher self HGA, etc. gives the impression we might be talking about possession or something. Is the experience quite the opposite? (Of course, if you were possessed, how could I trust ya anyways
The experience of my HGA, that I have had thus far, is not too disimilar to possesion in that it is outside of your normal, everyday consciousness. It is different in that it is not foriegn. It is more like falling in love, than being taken over, except that your lover lives in you, is always with you, is never waivering, never failing in his perfect passion for you. It is like....like....coming home.-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Specktackular
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]It is more like falling in love, than being taken over, except that your lover lives in you, is always with you, is never waivering, never failing in his perfect passion for you. It is like....like....coming home.[/QUOTE]
And since your avatar is Hellboy, I find this kinda creepy!
That's sort of what I didn't want to hear because possession freaks me out. Son of Sam did say he was practicing Golden Dawn.
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]It is more like falling in love, than being taken over, except that your lover lives in you, is always with you, is never waivering, never failing in his perfect passion for you. It is like....like....coming home.[/QUOTE]
And since your avatar is Hellboy, I find this kinda creepy!
That's sort of what I didn't want to hear because possession freaks me out. Son of Sam did say he was practicing Golden Dawn.-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Fr. Qim
[QUOTE=Specktackular]And since your avatar is Hellboy, I find this kinda creepy!.[/QUOTE]
HAHAH
Actually my Hellboy avatar was originally just because I'm a comic book geek. The movie was in production when I joined OF and I was really geared up for it. I do think it fits however, but only because of my slightly perverse sense of humor
The experience of one's HGA is unique for everyone. My HGA may be quite frightening to you, or comforting, there is no way to say. Yours may be likewise for me. A dispassionate look at the HGA is that it is the same as Samadhi in Yoga, literally "with the Lord" and is explained in that system as the cessation of thought. The HGA is the poetic expression birthed by the same experience in the western tradition. I have not experienced the Yogic method of Samadhi but I have heard that explanation from other Adepts, and it rings true to me.
In my opinion possesion is technically the oposite of the HGA experience in that it is the obsession of the mind by a growth or leasion. One of the false shadows of the WILL mentioned in my earlier post. We are almost always "possessed" by something. The HGA is a reclaiming of the self.
The reason it appears as "beyond" the normal conciousness is when you come through the experience (at least the limited one that I had) your "normal" waking conciousness returns, and you veiw the "experience" as an external one. The reason it is like a lover "inside" is that even though it is an "external" experience, it is the experience of the SELF, and the memory of that self remains with you.
Keep in mind that a great deal of your perception of this experience is dependant upon how you veiw your original nature. If the nature of man is sinful, than to cast off all your fetters is to fall prey to your baser instincts. If those baser instincts are simply shadows and false assumptions, born through repression and ignorance, than to cast off all your fetters is to allow your true divine nature to shine through. Which are you? Original sinner or original god?
[QUOTE=Specktackular]And since your avatar is Hellboy, I find this kinda creepy!
.[/QUOTE] HAHAH
Actually my Hellboy avatar was originally just because I'm a comic book geek. The movie was in production when I joined OF and I was really geared up for it. I do think it fits however, but only because of my slightly perverse sense of humor
The experience of one's HGA is unique for everyone. My HGA may be quite frightening to you, or comforting, there is no way to say. Yours may be likewise for me. A dispassionate look at the HGA is that it is the same as Samadhi in Yoga, literally "with the Lord" and is explained in that system as the cessation of thought. The HGA is the poetic expression birthed by the same experience in the western tradition. I have not experienced the Yogic method of Samadhi but I have heard that explanation from other Adepts, and it rings true to me.
In my opinion possesion is technically the oposite of the HGA experience in that it is the obsession of the mind by a growth or leasion. One of the false shadows of the WILL mentioned in my earlier post. We are almost always "possessed" by something. The HGA is a reclaiming of the self.
The reason it appears as "beyond" the normal conciousness is when you come through the experience (at least the limited one that I had) your "normal" waking conciousness returns, and you veiw the "experience" as an external one. The reason it is like a lover "inside" is that even though it is an "external" experience, it is the experience of the SELF, and the memory of that self remains with you.
Keep in mind that a great deal of your perception of this experience is dependant upon how you veiw your original nature. If the nature of man is sinful, than to cast off all your fetters is to fall prey to your baser instincts. If those baser instincts are simply shadows and false assumptions, born through repression and ignorance, than to cast off all your fetters is to allow your true divine nature to shine through. Which are you? Original sinner or original god?
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Specktackular
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]HAHAH
Actually my Hellboy avatar was originally just because I'm a comic book geek. The movie was in production when I joined OF and I was really geared up for it. I do think it fits however, but only because of my slightly perverse sense of humor
The experience of one's HGA is unique for everyone. My HGA may be quite frightening to you, or comforting, there is no way to say. Yours may be likewise for me. A dispassionate look at the HGA is that it is the same as Samadhi in Yoga, literally "with the Lord" and is explained in that system as the cessation of thought. The HGA is the poetic expression birthed by the same experience in the western tradition. I have not experienced the Yogic method of Samadhi but I have heard that explanation from other Adepts, and it rings true to me.
In my opinion possesion is technically the oposite of the HGA experience in that it is the obsession of the mind by a growth or leasion. One of the false shadows of the WILL mentioned in my earlier post. We are almost always "possessed" by something. The HGA is a reclaiming of the self.
The reason it appears as "beyond" the normal conciousness is when you come through the experience (at least the limited one that I had) your "normal" waking conciousness returns, and you veiw the "experience" as an external one. The reason it is like a lover "inside" is that even though it is an "external" experience, it is the experience of the SELF, and the memory of that self remains with you.
Keep in mind that a great deal of your perception of this experience is dependant upon how you veiw your original nature. If the nature of man is sinful, than to cast off all your fetters is to fall prey to your baser instincts. If those baser instincts are simply shadows and false assumptions, born through repression and ignorance, than to cast off all your fetters is to allow your true divine nature to shine through. Which are you? Original sinner or original god?[/QUOTE]
Now that gives me much to think about. I try to be good now that I've had plenty of experience being bad, so I hope I'm not an original sinner. The way you've described this reminds me of how I felt the first few times on acid. With time, that supernatural beauty faded, though, because it was fake.
Ya know, you and many others have really taken time to explain these things to me and I can't help but think that if I had met my HGA, etc. that I would be content to just sit quiet about it and let poor dopes like me flounder. It's got to be draining, even if you do like the subject matter.
[QUOTE=Fr. Qim]HAHAH
Actually my Hellboy avatar was originally just because I'm a comic book geek. The movie was in production when I joined OF and I was really geared up for it. I do think it fits however, but only because of my slightly perverse sense of humor
The experience of one's HGA is unique for everyone. My HGA may be quite frightening to you, or comforting, there is no way to say. Yours may be likewise for me. A dispassionate look at the HGA is that it is the same as Samadhi in Yoga, literally "with the Lord" and is explained in that system as the cessation of thought. The HGA is the poetic expression birthed by the same experience in the western tradition. I have not experienced the Yogic method of Samadhi but I have heard that explanation from other Adepts, and it rings true to me.
In my opinion possesion is technically the oposite of the HGA experience in that it is the obsession of the mind by a growth or leasion. One of the false shadows of the WILL mentioned in my earlier post. We are almost always "possessed" by something. The HGA is a reclaiming of the self.
The reason it appears as "beyond" the normal conciousness is when you come through the experience (at least the limited one that I had) your "normal" waking conciousness returns, and you veiw the "experience" as an external one. The reason it is like a lover "inside" is that even though it is an "external" experience, it is the experience of the SELF, and the memory of that self remains with you.
Keep in mind that a great deal of your perception of this experience is dependant upon how you veiw your original nature. If the nature of man is sinful, than to cast off all your fetters is to fall prey to your baser instincts. If those baser instincts are simply shadows and false assumptions, born through repression and ignorance, than to cast off all your fetters is to allow your true divine nature to shine through. Which are you? Original sinner or original god?[/QUOTE]
Now that gives me much to think about. I try to be good now that I've had plenty of experience being bad, so I hope I'm not an original sinner. The way you've described this reminds me of how I felt the first few times on acid. With time, that supernatural beauty faded, though, because it was fake.
Ya know, you and many others have really taken time to explain these things to me and I can't help but think that if I had met my HGA, etc. that I would be content to just sit quiet about it and let poor dopes like me flounder. It's got to be draining, even if you do like the subject matter.
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Fr. Qim
I enjoy the subject matter greatly, true. I also enjoy sharing my experiences and hearing others share their's. I enjoy teaching the little I know. It is my WILL to do so, sometimes it is my WILL to be silent. Sometimes I want to walk away, but my WILL pours forth in speach, othertimes the opposite. But seeing the light of understanding dawn in another's eyes, remembering when it first dawned in mine is something I find beautiful. Also an initiation changes both the initiate and the initiator.
I enjoy the subject matter greatly, true. I also enjoy sharing my experiences and hearing others share their's. I enjoy teaching the little I know. It is my WILL to do so, sometimes it is my WILL to be silent. Sometimes I want to walk away, but my WILL pours forth in speach, othertimes the opposite. But seeing the light of understanding dawn in another's eyes, remembering when it first dawned in mine is something I find beautiful. Also an initiation changes both the initiate and the initiator.
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: Captator
93
I have posted this in another forum and I will post my thoughts about it here aswell.
True will in itself is to me is consecration. That is to dedicate one's own being towards a certain goal.
My work to discover this true will is to get all my acts in life to work against the accomplishment of the great work. Meals, social meetings, reading, cleaning, my mind, my body, EVERYTHING! should be dedicated to the accomplishment of the great work. When all my acts are deidcated and are working towards this goal my true will will be perfectly clear
So for me to know my true will is not to find it in a box but to know it by knowing that everything, exactly everything I do is and only is dedicated towards the accomplishment of the great work.
Therefor truewill is to me to decide what one wants in life, having a goal, having a one pointed direction and see to that all what one is, is working towards that direction whatever that may be.
93 93/93
93
I have posted this in another forum and I will post my thoughts about it here aswell.
True will in itself is to me is consecration. That is to dedicate one's own being towards a certain goal.
My work to discover this true will is to get all my acts in life to work against the accomplishment of the great work. Meals, social meetings, reading, cleaning, my mind, my body, EVERYTHING! should be dedicated to the accomplishment of the great work. When all my acts are deidcated and are working towards this goal my true will will be perfectly clear
So for me to know my true will is not to find it in a box but to know it by knowing that everything, exactly everything I do is and only is dedicated towards the accomplishment of the great work.
Therefor truewill is to me to decide what one wants in life, having a goal, having a one pointed direction and see to that all what one is, is working towards that direction whatever that may be.
93 93/93
-
Occult Forum Archive
- Magister
- Posts: 287885
- Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2009 1:32 am
What's your True Will?
Original post: endor957
okay not for nothing but i thought this thread was asking what is your true will not, what is true will.
i'm sorry but i've read most of these pages and that seemed to be the general theme so i will say that i think my true will is to destroy, or it can be an illusion.
i say that because i destroy and there is nothing, i hate nothing because i am alone, being alone doesn't bring pain but it brings fear.
so then i asked why do i destroy, i think i destroy because i am denied; denied or rediculed to be me.
i was being me by creating, but what i had created was not within the status quo, even when i present myself it is not within the norm or acceptable.
so why can't i create after i destroy, because it comes down to being alone again and i'm scared of being alone.
so that's where i'm stuck at.
perhaps (if creating is my true will) my answer lies in creating so i wouldn't be alone.
i hope yall got that.
oh and i feel that creating is my true will because i am so natural at it and it is beautiful but destruction could be my will too inplace of it.
okay not for nothing but i thought this thread was asking what is your true will not, what is true will.
i'm sorry but i've read most of these pages and that seemed to be the general theme so i will say that i think my true will is to destroy, or it can be an illusion.
i say that because i destroy and there is nothing, i hate nothing because i am alone, being alone doesn't bring pain but it brings fear.
so then i asked why do i destroy, i think i destroy because i am denied; denied or rediculed to be me.
i was being me by creating, but what i had created was not within the status quo, even when i present myself it is not within the norm or acceptable.
so why can't i create after i destroy, because it comes down to being alone again and i'm scared of being alone.
so that's where i'm stuck at.
perhaps (if creating is my true will) my answer lies in creating so i wouldn't be alone.
i hope yall got that.
oh and i feel that creating is my true will because i am so natural at it and it is beautiful but destruction could be my will too inplace of it.