Original post: Genostar
Hi all,
It's been a long time since I've posted on here. I've been away from magick and studying psionics for a while, and now I've returned and brought a little psi with me. I've started up my daily routine again, and I feel freaking fantastic.
I still feel--as I did before I left magick--drawn to evocation, and I'd like to start the steps toward preparing for such an endeavor. I'm already aware of what that entails, so I won't be asking how to do evocation.
In searching about contacting spirits on OM, I ran across a handful of posts regarding meditation with the archangels whom we invoke during the LBRP/LIRP. I was very curious about this, as it seems one need do nothing more than perform the LBRP, LIRP, draw the invoking pentagram for the particular element (say, invoking pentagram of air for Raphael), and then meditate and ask the archangel to "step up" (to use someone else's phrase). This interests me, as I believe it would really help inspire and encourage me toward the pursuit of summoning and contacting spirits, though, as far as I can tell, it isn't evocation in a strict sense. Does anyone have any comments on this? Is my technique (LBRP, LIRP, invoking pentagram, meditation) sufficient to commune with the archangels?
On that note, I also have a question about the LIRP in general. Now, I've never really run across any text that says one should have to practice the LIRP, and as such the texts do not explain it at all, though for anyone who knows the LBRP it doesn't take any real stretch of the imagination to figure out how to do it and, of course, that it invokes instead of banishes. But the LBRP is more than banishing: we all know this, I hope. That being said, is the LIRP more than invoking? Is it useful in any other way than to communicate with archangels, as I just mentioned? Is the ritual important in any kind of magickal work? Some people use it for their daily routine, and I'm wondering why, and why not just use the SIRP? If one of the primary purposes of the LBRP is to remove all elemental energies from one's space (as the BRH removes all planetary energies from that space), is the LIRP just to bring in elemental energies--and, again, why would one use the LIRP over the SIRP, or vice-versa?
I suppose the upshot of my questioning is, I don't know what the LIRP or SIRP are for. My daily routine consists of the QC-LBRP-QC, BRH, MP, something else (maybe chakra work, meditation, or Tarot reading), and then usually a closing QC or LBRP. There's a lot of banishing and energy work in there, but not a lot of invoking of energies. I figured that before I use the LIRP to commune with archangels, I should learn why one would use the LIRP in the first place.
Alright, that's it. Thanks in advance.
Namaste,
Genostar
LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Radiant Star
I do similar rituals to you and I use the LBRP as a banishing ritual to gain a space and talk with my entities and although the Archangels are present, it is mainly with my beings that I talk and do whatever work needs to be done or work through personal things with them to do with growth.
If I want to talk to the Archangels specifically and not necessarily with any other entities, I invoke them using the LIRP, it feels different and the sense of closeness to the Archangels is more.
Hope this helps a bit somewhere along the line.
Rays
I do similar rituals to you and I use the LBRP as a banishing ritual to gain a space and talk with my entities and although the Archangels are present, it is mainly with my beings that I talk and do whatever work needs to be done or work through personal things with them to do with growth.
If I want to talk to the Archangels specifically and not necessarily with any other entities, I invoke them using the LIRP, it feels different and the sense of closeness to the Archangels is more.
Hope this helps a bit somewhere along the line.
Rays
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Nero
It is good to see you again my friend. Welcome back!
The method you are talking about is a technique of the GD and is pushed heavily by the Cicero's. It does work well but some people have varying results from it. I have recently been using a similer method that you might enjoy expermenting with.
Try creating a sigil of the archangel you want to contact using either the rose cross or planetary squares then meditate on them. The effects can be as simple as increased awareness to almost a full blown summoning. Try it and see what you think.
The answear to your question is kind of difficult to explain. I am tired at the moment so if I make a mistake please bear with me.
The LIRP involves the use of drawing in a sort of general elemental energy into our sphere. The SIRP involves more actual elemental energy, if this makes any sense. There is more to it than that of course but I hope that might steer you in the right direction. I had much more that I was going to write but my mind has gone blank right now.
Genostar wrote:Hi all,
It's been a long time since I've posted on here. I've been away from magick and studying psionics for a while, and now I've returned and brought a little psi with me. I've started up my daily routine again, and I feel freaking fantastic.
It is good to see you again my friend. Welcome back!
In searching about contacting spirits on OM, I ran across a handful of posts regarding meditation with the archangels whom we invoke during the LBRP/LIRP. I was very curious about this, as it seems one need do nothing more than perform the LBRP, LIRP, draw the invoking pentagram for the particular element (say, invoking pentagram of air for Raphael), and then meditate and ask the archangel to "step up" (to use someone else's phrase). This interests me, as I believe it would really help inspire and encourage me toward the pursuit of summoning and contacting spirits, though, as far as I can tell, it isn't evocation in a strict sense. Does anyone have any comments on this? Is my technique (LBRP, LIRP, invoking pentagram, meditation) sufficient to commune with the archangels?
The method you are talking about is a technique of the GD and is pushed heavily by the Cicero's. It does work well but some people have varying results from it. I have recently been using a similer method that you might enjoy expermenting with.
Try creating a sigil of the archangel you want to contact using either the rose cross or planetary squares then meditate on them. The effects can be as simple as increased awareness to almost a full blown summoning. Try it and see what you think.
On that note, I also have a question about the LIRP in general. Now, I've never really run across any text that says one should have to practice the LIRP, and as such the texts do not explain it at all, though for anyone who knows the LBRP it doesn't take any real stretch of the imagination to figure out how to do it and, of course, that it invokes instead of banishes. But the LBRP is more than banishing: we all know this, I hope. That being said, is the LIRP more than invoking? Is it useful in any other way than to communicate with archangels, as I just mentioned? Is the ritual important in any kind of magickal work? Some people use it for their daily routine, and I'm wondering why, and why not just use the SIRP? If one of the primary purposes of the LBRP is to remove all elemental energies from one's space (as the BRH removes all planetary energies from that space), is the LIRP just to bring in elemental energies--and, again, why would one use the LIRP over the SIRP, or vice-versa?
I suppose the upshot of my questioning is, I don't know what the LIRP or SIRP are for. My daily routine consists of the QC-LBRP-QC, BRH, MP, something else (maybe chakra work, meditation, or Tarot reading), and then usually a closing QC or LBRP. There's a lot of banishing and energy work in there, but not a lot of invoking of energies. I figured that before I use the LIRP to commune with archangels, I should learn why one would use the LIRP in the first place.
Alright, that's it. Thanks in advance.
Namaste,
Genostar
The answear to your question is kind of difficult to explain. I am tired at the moment so if I make a mistake please bear with me.
The LIRP involves the use of drawing in a sort of general elemental energy into our sphere. The SIRP involves more actual elemental energy, if this makes any sense. There is more to it than that of course but I hope that might steer you in the right direction. I had much more that I was going to write but my mind has gone blank right now.
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
[QUOTE=Nero]It is good to see you again my friend. Welcome back![/QUOTE] It's great to be back! It's good to see you too, Nero.
[QUOTE=Nero]The method you are talking about is a technique of the GD and is pushed heavily by the Cicero's. It does work well but some people have varying results from it. I have recently been using a similer method that you might enjoy expermenting with.
Try creating a sigil of the archangel you want to contact using either the rose cross or planetary squares then meditate on them. The effects can be as simple as increased awareness to almost a full blown summoning. Try it and see what you think.[/QUOTE]That sounds like an awesome technique! I think, in fact, I'm going to try the GD technique (LIRP with invoking pentagram) and your sigil technique: that is, I'll meditate on the sigil after I do the LIRP. I'll tell you how it goes! I'll be trying this tomorrow morning, as it is the first morning I'll have free in a while, and I hear you shouldn't do the LIRP at night; messes up sleep, evidently.
[QUOTE=Nero]The answear to your question is kind of difficult to explain. I am tired at the moment so if I make a mistake please bear with me.
The LIRP involves the use of drawing in a sort of general elemental energy into our sphere. The SIRP involves more actual elemental energy, if this makes any sense. There is more to it than that of course but I hope that might steer you in the right direction. I had much more that I was going to write but my mind has gone blank right now.[/QUOTE] No, that actually makes some sense! lol
Actually, thanks to your post and some focusing on my part, I think I can better summarize my dilemma. I'm confused as to why the LBRP and SIRP are so common, while the LIRP and SBRP are rarely mentioned. Is it tradition or are there more magickal reasons? I hope it's just tradition, since I'll be doing the LIRP tomorrow!
Great to be back again!
Namaste,
Genostar
[QUOTE=Nero]It is good to see you again my friend. Welcome back![/QUOTE] It's great to be back! It's good to see you too, Nero.
[QUOTE=Nero]The method you are talking about is a technique of the GD and is pushed heavily by the Cicero's. It does work well but some people have varying results from it. I have recently been using a similer method that you might enjoy expermenting with.
Try creating a sigil of the archangel you want to contact using either the rose cross or planetary squares then meditate on them. The effects can be as simple as increased awareness to almost a full blown summoning. Try it and see what you think.[/QUOTE]That sounds like an awesome technique! I think, in fact, I'm going to try the GD technique (LIRP with invoking pentagram) and your sigil technique: that is, I'll meditate on the sigil after I do the LIRP. I'll tell you how it goes! I'll be trying this tomorrow morning, as it is the first morning I'll have free in a while, and I hear you shouldn't do the LIRP at night; messes up sleep, evidently.
[QUOTE=Nero]The answear to your question is kind of difficult to explain. I am tired at the moment so if I make a mistake please bear with me.
The LIRP involves the use of drawing in a sort of general elemental energy into our sphere. The SIRP involves more actual elemental energy, if this makes any sense. There is more to it than that of course but I hope that might steer you in the right direction. I had much more that I was going to write but my mind has gone blank right now.[/QUOTE] No, that actually makes some sense! lol
Actually, thanks to your post and some focusing on my part, I think I can better summarize my dilemma. I'm confused as to why the LBRP and SIRP are so common, while the LIRP and SBRP are rarely mentioned. Is it tradition or are there more magickal reasons? I hope it's just tradition, since I'll be doing the LIRP tomorrow!
Great to be back again!
Namaste,
Genostar
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
Actually, for that matter, has anyone ever tried a basic evocation using the method Nero just outlined--that is, by meditating on a sigil? I think I've heard this in passing before: someone meditated on a spirit's sigil (this spirit, to be sure, wasn't necessarily an archangel) and was successful in communing with said spirit.
Is it possible to commune with spirits other than the four archangels of the LBRP using the sigil technique, Nero?
That sounds awfully dangerous, to be honest, but I'd like to hear what you all have to say anyway.
Namaste,
Genostar
Edit: For posterity, I found this very relevant thread about a frater who tried this same method to "evoke" a spirit:
http://www.occultforums.com/showthread.php?t=7043
Actually, for that matter, has anyone ever tried a basic evocation using the method Nero just outlined--that is, by meditating on a sigil? I think I've heard this in passing before: someone meditated on a spirit's sigil (this spirit, to be sure, wasn't necessarily an archangel) and was successful in communing with said spirit.
Is it possible to commune with spirits other than the four archangels of the LBRP using the sigil technique, Nero?
That sounds awfully dangerous, to be honest, but I'd like to hear what you all have to say anyway.
Namaste,
Genostar
Edit: For posterity, I found this very relevant thread about a frater who tried this same method to "evoke" a spirit:
http://www.occultforums.com/showthread.php?t=7043
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Nero
[QUOTE=Genostar]Actually, for that matter, has anyone ever tried a basic evocation using the method Nero just outlined--that is, by meditating on a sigil? I think I've heard this in passing before: someone meditated on a spirit's sigil (this spirit, to be sure, wasn't necessarily an archangel) and was successful in communing with said spirit.
Is it possible to commune with spirits other than the four archangels of the LBRP using the sigil technique, Nero?
That sounds awfully dangerous, to be honest, but I'd like to hear what you all have to say anyway.
Namaste,
Genostar
Edit: For posterity, I found this very relevant thread about a frater who tried this same method to "evoke" a spirit:
http://www.occultforums.com/showthread.php?t=7043[/QUOTE]Don't worry I wouldn't tell you to try something too dangerous. The method I outlined works wonders with sigils of God names, or things like the pentagammetion or tetragammeton, and yes you can use it for more than just the four angels of the LBRP. I have used it with other archangels with interesting results. Now I wouldn't try this with something nasty but I would hope you would know that.
-Just remember if something does show up TEST it first before you start chatting. You never know what you got.
[QUOTE=Genostar]Actually, for that matter, has anyone ever tried a basic evocation using the method Nero just outlined--that is, by meditating on a sigil? I think I've heard this in passing before: someone meditated on a spirit's sigil (this spirit, to be sure, wasn't necessarily an archangel) and was successful in communing with said spirit.
Is it possible to commune with spirits other than the four archangels of the LBRP using the sigil technique, Nero?
That sounds awfully dangerous, to be honest, but I'd like to hear what you all have to say anyway.
Namaste,
Genostar
Edit: For posterity, I found this very relevant thread about a frater who tried this same method to "evoke" a spirit:
http://www.occultforums.com/showthread.php?t=7043[/QUOTE]Don't worry I wouldn't tell you to try something too dangerous. The method I outlined works wonders with sigils of God names, or things like the pentagammetion or tetragammeton, and yes you can use it for more than just the four angels of the LBRP. I have used it with other archangels with interesting results. Now I wouldn't try this with something nasty but I would hope you would know that.
-Just remember if something does show up TEST it first before you start chatting. You never know what you got.
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
[QUOTE=Nero]Don't worry I wouldn't tell you to try something too dangerous. The method I outlined works wonders with sigils of God names, or things like the pentagammetion or tetragammeton, and yes you can use it for more than just the four angels of the LBRP. I have used it with other archangels with interesting results. Now I wouldn't try this with something nasty but I would hope you would know that.
-Just remember if something does show up TEST it first before you start chatting. You never know what you got.[/QUOTE] That's awesome, Nero. Thanks! I'll be trying it tomorrow.
Just as a note to anyone reading this: I have studied evocation fairly extensively, and though I haven't actually practiced it, I at least have some idea of what I have in store for me. As such, I'm also aware that evocation is dangerous if done incorrectly, and one should be versed in banishing and the proper rituals, and should also do proper research before taking up any evocation endeavor. You should also know how to test the veracity of any spirit you encounter--and there are a plethora of resources on this to study up on. So, be careful, and do your homework!
This advice actually applies to all magick!
Namaste,
Genostar
[QUOTE=Nero]Don't worry I wouldn't tell you to try something too dangerous. The method I outlined works wonders with sigils of God names, or things like the pentagammetion or tetragammeton, and yes you can use it for more than just the four angels of the LBRP. I have used it with other archangels with interesting results. Now I wouldn't try this with something nasty but I would hope you would know that.
-Just remember if something does show up TEST it first before you start chatting. You never know what you got.[/QUOTE] That's awesome, Nero. Thanks! I'll be trying it tomorrow.
Just as a note to anyone reading this: I have studied evocation fairly extensively, and though I haven't actually practiced it, I at least have some idea of what I have in store for me. As such, I'm also aware that evocation is dangerous if done incorrectly, and one should be versed in banishing and the proper rituals, and should also do proper research before taking up any evocation endeavor. You should also know how to test the veracity of any spirit you encounter--and there are a plethora of resources on this to study up on. So, be careful, and do your homework!
This advice actually applies to all magick!
Namaste,
Genostar
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Nero
If you are worried about working with any sort of spirit or intellegence then there are a lot of other ways you can apply this method.
Here is an example:
I have been working on a sigil I created of the name Yeheshua from the rose cross for meditation. I usually begin with empty minded as I burn the sigil into my brain followed by continplative meditation to see what comes up. It is often either symbols or train of thought. Here is a recent experence of train of thought:
Yeheshua is the completed man, and it is also called the pentagammetion. The pentagammeton is symbolized by the pentagram. The pentagram is a symbol of the 27th path. The 27th pathâ??s tarot card is the blasted tower. So, adept hood leads to or is a product of the destruction of the ego.
I thought that was pretty neat....
If you are worried about working with any sort of spirit or intellegence then there are a lot of other ways you can apply this method.
Here is an example:
I have been working on a sigil I created of the name Yeheshua from the rose cross for meditation. I usually begin with empty minded as I burn the sigil into my brain followed by continplative meditation to see what comes up. It is often either symbols or train of thought. Here is a recent experence of train of thought:
Yeheshua is the completed man, and it is also called the pentagammetion. The pentagammeton is symbolized by the pentagram. The pentagram is a symbol of the 27th path. The 27th pathâ??s tarot card is the blasted tower. So, adept hood leads to or is a product of the destruction of the ego.
I thought that was pretty neat....
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
So, I just tried the meditation. I wanted to contact Chassan, the Angel of Air, so I did the LBRP, then LIRP, then drew an invoking pentagram of air in the east and meditated on Chassan's sigil (which I had drawn before the ceremony on a large piece of paper) and vibrated his name repeatedly. I think I did this for about 8 minutes or so--I'm not sure, because I began to get into a mild trance.
I didn't get much. I could've sworn there was a presence in the room, but that might have been paranoia. I think I saw my notebook, which was in the circle with me, shine with words, but then they quickly disappeared. The air rang and tingled: that much I knew for sure. After I was done vibrating, when I saw something out of the corner of my eye, I meditated on the air and there was this very loud humming.
Outside of all that, I didn't get much else save for one thing: the image of whom I believe was Chassan. He seemed kind of effeminate, maybe androgynous, with a slender face and sharp chin (much like Raphael, of course), and he was wearing this long brownish robe of sorts, maybe even a gown or dress. He had an archaic smile and I felt benevolence and almost pity come from him, kind of like, "Oh, cute little novice magician, you'll get more from me, but not yet." There wasn't anything striking about this vision, though: just an image that flashed.
I closed the ceremony with the Qabalistic cross and some more grounding, and then cleaned up.
Very cool experience, even if I didn't experience anything "spectacular," but I'm not sure if I was looking for that. I might try contacting him again in the future, but for now I am so hungry! Does ceremony do that to anyone else?
Namaste,
Genostar
So, I just tried the meditation. I wanted to contact Chassan, the Angel of Air, so I did the LBRP, then LIRP, then drew an invoking pentagram of air in the east and meditated on Chassan's sigil (which I had drawn before the ceremony on a large piece of paper) and vibrated his name repeatedly. I think I did this for about 8 minutes or so--I'm not sure, because I began to get into a mild trance.
I didn't get much. I could've sworn there was a presence in the room, but that might have been paranoia. I think I saw my notebook, which was in the circle with me, shine with words, but then they quickly disappeared. The air rang and tingled: that much I knew for sure. After I was done vibrating, when I saw something out of the corner of my eye, I meditated on the air and there was this very loud humming.
Outside of all that, I didn't get much else save for one thing: the image of whom I believe was Chassan. He seemed kind of effeminate, maybe androgynous, with a slender face and sharp chin (much like Raphael, of course), and he was wearing this long brownish robe of sorts, maybe even a gown or dress. He had an archaic smile and I felt benevolence and almost pity come from him, kind of like, "Oh, cute little novice magician, you'll get more from me, but not yet." There wasn't anything striking about this vision, though: just an image that flashed.
I closed the ceremony with the Qabalistic cross and some more grounding, and then cleaned up.
Very cool experience, even if I didn't experience anything "spectacular," but I'm not sure if I was looking for that. I might try contacting him again in the future, but for now I am so hungry! Does ceremony do that to anyone else?
Namaste,
Genostar
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Radiant Star
Sounds good to me!
I prefer to ritual before eating and not on a full stomach, so it would be normal to feel hungry if it had been intense and a meal time was approaching.
I feel so excited so for you
Hope you are taking precautions too
Rays
Sounds good to me!
I prefer to ritual before eating and not on a full stomach, so it would be normal to feel hungry if it had been intense and a meal time was approaching.
I feel so excited so for you
Hope you are taking precautions too
Rays
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
[QUOTE=Radiant Star]Sounds good to me!
I prefer to ritual before eating and not on a full stomach, so it would be normal to feel hungry if it had been intense and a meal time was approaching.
I feel so excited so for you
Hope you are taking precautions too
Rays
[/QUOTE] Thanks Rays! *hug* There will be more to come. This path that I'm walking on is so exciting! Waking up is really easy when you know that life is magickal.
And I hope that I'm taking precautions too! Or at least I think I am! :neutral: Oh no, I'm paranoid again!
I think a Pop Tart should fix that. Okay, and maybe eggs--something more filling.
Neurotically yours,
Genostar
[QUOTE=Radiant Star]Sounds good to me!
I prefer to ritual before eating and not on a full stomach, so it would be normal to feel hungry if it had been intense and a meal time was approaching.
I feel so excited so for you
Hope you are taking precautions too
Rays
[/QUOTE] Thanks Rays! *hug* There will be more to come. This path that I'm walking on is so exciting! Waking up is really easy when you know that life is magickal.
And I hope that I'm taking precautions too! Or at least I think I am! :neutral: Oh no, I'm paranoid again!
I think a Pop Tart should fix that. Okay, and maybe eggs--something more filling.
Neurotically yours,
Genostar
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Radiant Star
You will get used to being paranoid, although I wouldn't skip the food ! :lol:
Rays
You will get used to being paranoid, although I wouldn't skip the food ! :lol:
Rays
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Grab
Sounds good to me too.
Did you do the earth LIRP?
Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab
Sounds good to me too.
Did you do the earth LIRP?
Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
[QUOTE=Grab]Sounds good to me too.
Did you do the earth LIRP?
Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab[/QUOTE] Hey Grab, yeah, I did do the earth LIRP. (By the way, I never realized how accustomed I am to the banishing pentagrams; drawing the invoking pentagrams were actually kind of challenging!)
I used the dagger for both the LBRP and LIRP, and I imagine that if I were to do the SIRP in the future I'd use the four elemental weapons. N.B., I 90% of the time use just my finger, but when I'm feeling like I need an extra psychodramatic boost, I bust out with my very pretty dagger/athame.
I'll bet that the usage of tools varies from magician to magician, Grab, but I would be interested also if anyone had any comments, suggestions, and personal advice concerning the usage of particular weapons during the LBRP, LIRP, and SIRP. Yeah, if anyone has a recommended guideline, that'd be cool.
In general, I've read and heard that during the LBRP (and I presume the LIRP) people recommend either your finger or the non-elemental dagger, and that during the SIRP (and I presume the SBRP) the four elemental weapons are recommended.
Namaste,
Genostar
[QUOTE=Grab]Sounds good to me too.
Did you do the earth LIRP?
Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab[/QUOTE] Hey Grab, yeah, I did do the earth LIRP. (By the way, I never realized how accustomed I am to the banishing pentagrams; drawing the invoking pentagrams were actually kind of challenging!)
I used the dagger for both the LBRP and LIRP, and I imagine that if I were to do the SIRP in the future I'd use the four elemental weapons. N.B., I 90% of the time use just my finger, but when I'm feeling like I need an extra psychodramatic boost, I bust out with my very pretty dagger/athame.
I'll bet that the usage of tools varies from magician to magician, Grab, but I would be interested also if anyone had any comments, suggestions, and personal advice concerning the usage of particular weapons during the LBRP, LIRP, and SIRP. Yeah, if anyone has a recommended guideline, that'd be cool.
In general, I've read and heard that during the LBRP (and I presume the LIRP) people recommend either your finger or the non-elemental dagger, and that during the SIRP (and I presume the SBRP) the four elemental weapons are recommended.
Namaste,
Genostar
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Radiant Star
Personally, I have never used physical tools, but if you have read soomewhere that you can use this tool for this or that reason or whatever, then thinking logically, both ways have worked for someone somewhere ! so choose the one idea that you are most drawn too, it is not the rules that count, it is using a safe route that gets a good result at the end of the day.
Rays
Personally, I have never used physical tools, but if you have read soomewhere that you can use this tool for this or that reason or whatever, then thinking logically, both ways have worked for someone somewhere ! so choose the one idea that you are most drawn too, it is not the rules that count, it is using a safe route that gets a good result at the end of the day.
Rays
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Frater Manjet
[QUOTE=Grab]Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab[/QUOTE]Personaly I will not use my Pent dagger for anything outside of the LBRP/LIRP. This does not mean I will not use other tools for these rituals.
As to the SBRP/SIRP, I would never use one elemental tool without the other three. I do however perform these rituals with other tools such as Lotus wand , sword etc...
- VVV
[QUOTE=Grab]Somewhere I read that one should use the usual LBRP-dagger also for LIRP and SIRP, but somewhere else I read that the LBRP-dagger should ONLY be used for LBRP. Yet another place I read that one uses the elemental weapons for the LIRP (one of four) and SIRP (all four). Anyone has a good guideline for how to do it?
/Grab[/QUOTE]Personaly I will not use my Pent dagger for anything outside of the LBRP/LIRP. This does not mean I will not use other tools for these rituals.
As to the SBRP/SIRP, I would never use one elemental tool without the other three. I do however perform these rituals with other tools such as Lotus wand , sword etc...
- VVV
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Grab
Thanks for the answers re weapons, just what I wanted!
I read about the earth LIRP on the Lyam site, and they introduce a number of changes. They have green pents and green circle instead of blue+white, they add the Taurus sigil in black and they also have Adonai Ha-aretz in each direction instead of the standard Yhvh,Adni,Eheie,Agla. Are these changes good practice or not?
/Grab
EDIT: It is not a LIRP on the Lyam site, just the formulation of the pents (thus, no QC, no archangels etc)
Thanks for the answers re weapons, just what I wanted!
I read about the earth LIRP on the Lyam site, and they introduce a number of changes. They have green pents and green circle instead of blue+white, they add the Taurus sigil in black and they also have Adonai Ha-aretz in each direction instead of the standard Yhvh,Adni,Eheie,Agla. Are these changes good practice or not?
/Grab
EDIT: It is not a LIRP on the Lyam site, just the formulation of the pents (thus, no QC, no archangels etc)
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Nero
[QUOTE=Grab]Thanks for the answers re weapons, just what I wanted!
I read about the earth LIRP on the Lyam site, and they introduce a number of changes. They have green pents and green circle instead of blue+white, they add the Taurus sigil in black and they also have Adonai Ha-aretz in each direction instead of the standard Yhvh,Adni,Eheie,Agla. Are these changes good practice or not?
/Grab
EDIT: It is not a LIRP on the Lyam site, just the formulation of the pents (thus, no QC, no archangels etc)[/QUOTE]Yes I am familer with Lyam's site. It is just another variation on the invoking pentagram ritual. It is almost a SIRP of earth with the enochian elements stripped out. I really like the use of the godname of earth/Malkuth in place of the traditional lesser pentagram formula. (It goes well with Zelator work if you are working through the outer order) IMO it is a good version and can be used to great effect. It is geared more towards GD elemental grade work but I see no reason why you could not use it for general invoking elemental work. The only advice I can give you is try it and see. If you like it better go with it. Above all else go with what works. This is true in life and magick.
[QUOTE=Grab]Thanks for the answers re weapons, just what I wanted!
I read about the earth LIRP on the Lyam site, and they introduce a number of changes. They have green pents and green circle instead of blue+white, they add the Taurus sigil in black and they also have Adonai Ha-aretz in each direction instead of the standard Yhvh,Adni,Eheie,Agla. Are these changes good practice or not?
/Grab
EDIT: It is not a LIRP on the Lyam site, just the formulation of the pents (thus, no QC, no archangels etc)[/QUOTE]Yes I am familer with Lyam's site. It is just another variation on the invoking pentagram ritual. It is almost a SIRP of earth with the enochian elements stripped out. I really like the use of the godname of earth/Malkuth in place of the traditional lesser pentagram formula. (It goes well with Zelator work if you are working through the outer order) IMO it is a good version and can be used to great effect. It is geared more towards GD elemental grade work but I see no reason why you could not use it for general invoking elemental work. The only advice I can give you is try it and see. If you like it better go with it. Above all else go with what works. This is true in life and magick.
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LIRP, SIRP: Invoking vs. Banishing Rituals, and Archangels
Original post: Genostar
[QUOTE=Nero]The only advice I can give you is try it and see. If you like it better go with it. Above all else go with what works. This is true in life and magick.[/QUOTE] Amen, frater.
G
[QUOTE=Nero]The only advice I can give you is try it and see. If you like it better go with it. Above all else go with what works. This is true in life and magick.[/QUOTE] Amen, frater.
G